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View Poll Results: How religious are you?

Voters
43. You may not vote on this poll
  • Not at all; I'm an atheist.

    9 20.93%
  • Not at all; I'm an agnostic.

    11 25.58%
  • Somewhat; I have vague, idiosyncratic religious beliefs of a metaphysical nature

    5 11.63%
  • Somewhat; I have some faith in the metaphysical tenets of an organized religion

    1 2.33%
  • Decidedly; I have defined, idiosyncratic religious beliefs of a metaphysical nature

    4 9.30%
  • Decidedly; I have considerable faith in the metaphysical tenets of an organized religion

    13 30.23%
  • I believe in evolution

    21 48.84%
  • I don't believe in evolution

    7 16.28%
  • I don't know whether I believe in evolution

    4 9.30%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Results 11 to 20 of 54

  1. #11
    Dhampyr Economica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    I would like to see it answered before I vote.
    All right then.

    By belief in evolution I mean Oberon67's options 2 and 3 - though I'm not sure I understand the difference between the two. Is my discarding option 1 enough for you?

    Yes, you won't hear me wanting to burn you alive. I'm smart enough to see what you're actually talking about first, then decide whether or not I wish to remain or participate.
    Good for you.

  2. #12
    Dhampyr Economica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon67 View Post
    The information at hand was sufficient to produce an answer that fit within the context of your question, so it worked for me.
    So IIUC, regardless of which of your three options I meant, you would have answered the same?

    Edit: Sorry about the double post.

  3. #13
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    One should be able to select both agnostic and atheist. I selected atheist because I am decidedly without theistic belief, however I am not gnostic in that I do not claim any certainty. I am a skeptic, despite my belief that one has to assume the stance with the knowledge one has.

  4. #14
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Economica View Post
    All right then.

    By belief in evolution I mean Oberon67's options 2 and 3 - though I'm not sure I understand the difference between the two. Is my discarding option 1 enough for you?
    2 still goes against my beliefs while 3 I can accept; I'm still stuck between a rock and a hard place on that subject.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

    INFP, 6w7, IEI

    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

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  5. #15
    Dhampyr Economica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    One should be able to select both agnostic and atheist. I selected atheist because I am decidedly without theistic belief, however I am not gnostic in that I do not claim any certainty. I am a skeptic, despite my belief that one has to assume the stance with the knowledge one has.
    I've had this discussion too many times to go into it again, but for the record, I consider agnostics to be a (wishy-washy ) subset of atheists.

  6. #16
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    What is it with people following a religion? Why not create their own?

    I voted on Number 3. But, I don't consider my beliefs vague.

  7. #17
    Dhampyr Economica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    2 still goes against my beliefs while 3 I can accept; I'm still stuck between a rock and a hard place on that subject.
    If you'll elaborate the difference between the two, I'll be happy to clarify my definition.

  8. #18
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Economica View Post
    If you'll elaborate the difference between the two, I'll be happy to clarify my definition.
    The origin of biodiversity vs. observed changes in a lab: the changes in a lab are observations of how things can work where as the origin of biodiversity is a speculation (theory) that requires some amount of faith.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

    INFP, 6w7, IEI

    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

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  9. #19
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Economica View Post
    By belief in evolution I mean Oberon67's options 2 and 3 - though I'm not sure I understand the difference between the two.
    The difference between the two is the difference between microevolution and macroevolution.

    Microevolution is the process by which bacteria become resistant to antibiotics, to give an example. Kill off 99 percent of a population of Staphylococcus aureus with a dose of tetracycline, and the remaining one percent is the one percent that had some trait in its makeup that enabled it to survive. Surviving, the bacteria pass the trait along to successive generations of that population of S. aureus. Continue to administer the same dosage of tetracycline to those generations, and in short order your population of S. aureus is now completely tetracycline-resistant. However...and this is important...the bacteria remain S. aureus.

    Macroevolution is the process by which, in theory, adaptive changes in successive generations of a population of organisms yields a new species. This mechanism is thought to account for taxonomical differences like legs instead of fins, feathers instead of scales, and so on. In order for such transitions to occur, several fairly high hurdles have to be overcome. First, there has to be enough variation in the genetic code between successive generations to yield an adaptive trait. Second, this trait has to come through in one generation fully-formed enough to yield a competitive advantage to that generation...a quasi-leg that looks vaguely like a fin may or may not help your critter survive. Third, the individuals with the adaptation can't be cross-fertile with their distant cousins who didn't inherit the trait. If they are cross-fertile with those other individuals (barring infertile inter-species hybrids such as mules), they're the same species. So, in short, macroevolution is the process that would apply if you...or nature...were to breed lizards together successively under conditions favorable to birds until you produced a bird.

    There are various theoretical answers to all of the questions that might potentially weaken macroevolution as a theory, but evidence of observed macroevolution in the wild is scant. A population of critters known as Ring salamanders are the best case to date of which I'm aware, and are under intense scrutiny as a result.

    Do I believe in macroevolution? Partly. I think it's inadequate, a flawed model.

  10. #20
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Economica View Post
    So IIUC, regardless of which of your three options I meant, you would have answered the same?
    As long as I was ignorant of your intent, yes.

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