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  1. #11
    Systematic chaos Cenomite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    Hmmm, no. Which one?

    This thread was inspired by comments and situations presented to me IRL as well as some posts I've read on the forum, but yours wasn't one of them. Why do you say that?
    Ahh, I posted something about this in a thread you were in just a bit before you made this thread, figured it was part of it. Please refer to the note at the top then


    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    Hmm...x2 honestly, you totally lost me here! LOL. Not joking.
    I saw that as you knocking people who say they are intuitive for taking their assumptions about people as accurate, while at the same time assuming people who claim to be intuitive are certain ways. Did I get the wrong message from what you posted?

    EDIT: Clarified a bit.
    The probability that I was procrastinating when I was typing this post:

    P(have big assignment due) = 0.6
    P(posting on TypoC) = 0.2
    P(having big assignment due | posting on TypoC) = 0.7

    P(posting on TypoC | having big assignment due) = .......


    Eh, I'll finish it later.

  2. #12
    I'm a star. Kangirl's Avatar
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    Let's be friends! LOL.

    PS Even when I thought I 'got' people, I never said it out loud. I intuitively thought it was not the thing to do.
    Yes, lets. But please note that I am an ENTJ. Apparently I can only be friends with people who are willing to do my bidding. Cool? Btw, I do what you described above as well. Of course I get impressions and ideas of people, like everyone, but I always try to keep it in the forefront of my mind that *I might be wrong*. And, yeah, I always intuited that saying it would be the wrong thing to do, as well. I actually kind of really hate armchair psychologizing in general, I find it lazy.
    "Only an irrational dumbass, would burn Jews." - Jaguar

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  3. #13
    Senior Member Maabus1999's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangirl View Post
    Apparently I can only be friends with people who are willing to do my bidding. Cool?
    I just use my mind control ray to make peo...err friends. Yeah...

    They know too much...

  4. #14
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    The caveat - I maybe perhaps once used to think I was a very intuitive person. My paranoia and secretiveness was tied into my intuition (yeah, and I'm *not* INFJ, go figure).

    I got people. I understood people. I read people like open books.

    Then I got over myself.

    I think whether or not it's been verified that you are indeed an 'intuitive' person and can CORRECTLY 'get' other people's motives, thoughts, secrets, etc. -- you should NOT get too confident.

    I've seen train seen wrecks of people, train wrecks, tell me that they are really good at reading other people and they "get" things.

    I'm like, "Really????"

    'Cause if you're so good at reading people and intuitively understanding human nature - how come you suck so hard at your own relationships??? x3

    Seriously, not to be a hater, and I do agree that some people (or even some types) are better at picking up the unspoken better than others -- BUT, pride comes before a fall.

    I think this kind of hubris, especially in regards to what you THINK you almost magically "understand" about other people but really you're just assuming about other people is very dangerous. And unfair. And most of the time from what I've seen, not even accurate.

    Now, I do NOT think of myself as an intuitive person who 'gets' other people. I'm just me. You're just you. Until you *show* me something, I do not presume to understand you.

    Thoughts?
    Yeah, Cze I'm feeling you here. The sheer volume/interest of problematic relationship threads for a forum dominated by intuitives who you know, supposedly connect the dots faster/better than the general sensor population, read the unspoken and unsaid. I could pick up an issue of Cosmo or Maxim and read the exact same problems with the exact same answers, sans the galling amount of type stereotypes thrown into the mix.

    It's horrible to encounter a person who believes they've been endowed with superpowers (I see this mostly as a NF problem, especially with the N-dominant NFs) that allow them to glance at a person and automatically read them like an Dr. Seuss book. That means they're really not open to really getting to know the person. You've got them figured out so why bother. I'm looking at the INFJ not attracted to sensors thread and shaking my head. Act like you don't know for once, you may learn something.

    There is a crazy amount of hubris and reliance of people on the forum about their "intuition." It's gotten to the point that simply asking for concrete examples or proof of asserted claims shows your lack of intuition. NO, I thought it meant you have the ability to think critically and have healthy skepticism about things. People don't even have to manifest intuition that's functional, well-adjusted, and healthy it just has to something emulating intuition. Show yourself to be zany, crazy, non-conformist, aberrant, deviant, have a tenuous grasp of reality, "think outside the box" (or just say that you do) is enough.

    It's so funny, I was watching CNN yesterday and they had Nouriel "Dr. Doom" Roubini as a commentator. He was the guy who was predicting in 2006 that our economy was going to tank within the next five years. I immediately identified him as an INTx. It was so funny to hear a intuitive using phrases "realistic assessment" or "the American people need to be realistic about the financial crisis and the repercussions..." I kinda stated thinking about the forum and how most Ns here are proud of how unrealistic and head in the clouds they are and disdainful of having your feet on the ground. It's like being a grounded person and intuitive are mutually exclusive. I don't know this is something that's always puzzled me about the forum.

    Which is why I've just tired of typology as more than just hobby. I look at the people around me and how complex they are as humans, how much they do that I just don't understand and how much I probably do they don't understand and it's humbling. It's like looking at the Grand Canyon and just feeling humbled and awed and knowing how small you are in comparison. I certainly don't have any superpowers. I agree with you that there are people who have a better grasp on human nature, but I don't think it's because of type or intuition.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  5. #15
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    Great topic CzeCze. It is easy to fall into the trap of assuming you know more about other people than you really do. As proteanmix mentioned once you have them "figured out" you don't bother learning any more about them. It puts them into a box and you set up a self fulfilling prophesy. You end up treating them (either consciously or unconsciously) a certain way based on who you believe them to be, which colors how they interact with you. I hate when people put me in a box so I do my damnedest to keep from putting other people there. Sure my intuition is often right, so what? I try and use it to find out what makes people tick so I can understand them, but I know Ni tries to jump to conclusions so I struggle to stay open minded. I literally fight my own intuition.

    When people act the way you expect them to, you stop being surprised by them and the "I told you so's" creep in. I discovered long ago that people really do need to make mistakes to learn and grow. You don't do them any favors usually by pointing out the future you see for them. Maybe this is easier as an introverted thinker, to just observe instead of getting involved, extroverted feelers probably struggle with the urge to help more than I do.

  6. #16
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cenomite View Post
    I generally don't act on my assumptions about people unless they prove my intuition correct. I'm not going to walk into a room, instantly label everyone, and treat them accordingly. There's a difference between being intuitive and being a presumptuous dick.

    Am I full of myself for thinking I'm right most of the time? Probably. I see nothing wrong with that unless you act on your intuitions about other people that have not been proven true.
    Well put.


    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix
    That means they're really not open to really getting to know the person.
    Okay, this thread is starting to be generalization after generalization. I'm very open to knowing people. I thrive on it, even. Doesn't mean I don't have a few preconceived ideas about the person before I get to know him/her and it doesn't mean those same ideas are shared with others in any serious manner. Those ideas are kept inside my head..

    And you should take MBTI as a hobby right from the get-go. Before it proves itself useful in any way, it will remain just random curiosity for me personally.

  7. #17
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
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    Well from my own personal vantage point I always found that I was right about stuff.. until I realized in my early 20s I was right about stuff that wasn't directly attached to me. It freaked my husband out how I could tell what someone was like when I met them. I didn't put any deep meaning to it, I just sorta read people and went with it.

    In my 20s I realized that when something is close to me I have a hard time reading it. If it includes me I have to step back and take time to look at it without leaping to a conclusion.

    Enter MBTI I find out I am ENFP - and what does that mean? I have external intutition. Wow, thats exactly what I have realized over the years of growth. So I don't think I have some kind of magical intuition because of MB. I think I do because of personal experience.

    What's really the big benefit to sitting around and knowing what people are like before spending a bunch of time with them? Nothing much, but that's kinda how it happens with me. Big deal.

  8. #18
    Senior Member Grayscale's Avatar
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    Yes... although I think it's great that so many people can recognize that patterns do exist, also that people can have self-confidence, but when the two are combined and the person begins to believe their grasp of patterns is so great that they no longer need to draw upon objective, factual information, they end up coming to conclusions which should have never been made.


    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...t-general.html

  9. #19
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    I've used my "intuition" to discover a great trick about reading people. Ask them personal questions. You might be surprised how much people want to open up about their personality, values, interests, ect... to someone who is actively listening.
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  10. #20
    I'm a star. Kangirl's Avatar
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    Another thought on this subject:

    I think that being un-intuitive is rarer than being intuitive. In others words, I'm not convinced a certain skill at 'reading' people is necessarily uncommon - most people are fairly good at getting a read on others, it's not surprising that we're right much of the time. It's not very often I meet someone who's noticeably *misreading* others. The person I know who is worst at intuiting other people is diagnosed bipolar, which I think has a lot to do with it.
    "Only an irrational dumbass, would burn Jews." - Jaguar

    "please give concise answers in plain English" - request from Provoker

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