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  1. #31
    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    Bureaucracy is less fair than life.
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

  2. #32
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    ^ This is why I agree that she was punished.. I just feel like we're taken as "easy" targets when it comes to things like this in comparison to a bus environment. It doesn't make much sense to me, to have anything offered for students as a privilage, and not have any standards to uphold for said privilage.
    I think enforcing class environment standards in a bus environment would be a pain in the ass. You'd need bus wardens or something. I doubt bus-drivers get a lot of training in maintaining discipline. "Shut up, you little brats" is probably the first and last resort. Their priority is to get the kids home safely. A teacher's priority is to teach the kids, which requires class discipline. It's not a perfect world.

  3. #33
    Lallygag Moderator Geoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Works View Post
    Tell you what. I'll let you in on a little secret of how to piss of your teachers and not get in trouble. Be overly polite. American society (I'm assuming American since Kyuuei is from Texas) has a specific set of politeness rules and strategies. (See Grice or Brown and Levinson). The more politeness indicators we use in our interactions, the most interpersonal distance we are conveying with one another. This is why we are often very casual with our friends and drop things like please and thank you. The less we know someone, or the more distance we are from them, the more politeness strategies we use. Ever watch two women who hate each other interact? Their every word is dripping with excess politeness. In any case, flaunt the rules of politeness, but don't be sarcastic. This may be a fine line to walk. The teacher will be pissed off without knowing why (unless they have a linguistics background) and your sister won't be suspended.
    Be careful how you try this in the UK, the British standard of politeness and formality is quite different (and it is difficult to show disdain with politeness!)

  4. #34
    mrs disregard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphosis View Post
    Bureaucracy is less fair than life.
    But it is a part of life. It exists in life.

  5. #35
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
    Be careful how you try this in the UK, the British standard of politeness and formality is quite different (and it is difficult to show disdain with politeness!)
    cf.: "He was never more sinister than when he was most polite, which is probably the truest test of breeding" - of Captain Hook, Peter Pan.

  6. #36
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphosis View Post
    Bureaucracy is less fair than life.
    QFT. <3

    Quote Originally Posted by JivinJeffJones View Post
    I think enforcing class environment standards in a bus environment would be a pain in the ass. You'd need bus wardens or something. I doubt bus-drivers get a lot of training in maintaining discipline. "Shut up, you little brats" is probably the first and last resort. Their priority is to get the kids home safely. A teacher's priority is to teach the kids, which requires class discipline. It's not a perfect world.
    Hm. This part is true. But I think I am still right that a code of conduct of sorts has to be enforced. Racial slurs being used just because it's not in school makes it no more right. People have the right to take others to court over discrimination outside of school. Tolerance for violence, fighting, and cussing should not be limited just because it is outside of school, but moreso. People don't get into crashes and accidents in a classroom. Since bus-wardens would be expensive, it seems only appropriate that their behavior during school-related things reflects onto what the school can do: Punishments within the school system.

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
    Be careful how you try this in the UK, the British standard of politeness and formality is quite different (and it is difficult to show disdain with politeness!)
    Interesting enough, today in Japanese101 we were taught that a word meaning "Repeat what you just said?" seems very rude, and that instead you need to say "what is it?" because it sounds more delicate and polite.. even if you say the former word more sweetly than the latter.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
    Halla74: Think your way through the world. Feel your way through life.

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  7. #37
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Works View Post
    Tell you what. I'll let you in on a little secret of how to piss of your teachers and not get in trouble. Be overly polite. American society (I'm assuming American since Kyuuei is from Texas) has a specific set of politeness rules and strategies. (See Grice or Brown and Levinson). The more politeness indicators we use in our interactions, the most interpersonal distance we are conveying with one another. This is why we are often very casual with our friends and drop things like please and thank you. The less we know someone, or the more distance we are from them, the more politeness strategies we use. Ever watch two women who hate each other interact? Their every word is dripping with excess politeness. In any case, flaunt the rules of politeness, but don't be sarcastic. This may be a fine line to walk. The teacher will be pissed off without knowing why (unless they have a linguistics background) and your sister won't be suspended.
    I have new ammunition for life. Thanks, Works!

  8. #38
    Senior Member Works's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    Interesting enough, today in Japanese101 we were taught that a word meaning "Repeat what you just said?" seems very rude, and that instead you need to say "what is it?" because it sounds more delicate and polite.. even if you say the former word more sweetly than the latter.
    The rules of politeness in Japan are codified into the very grammar. It's a complicated society. Sorry for derailing your thread with random intellectual pursuits.

    BTW, I would try the school board and superintendent if you're really serious about this. Uh, is your Dad still working for the school? That may cause problems for job stability. The last thing a teacher wants to hear is that a parent went over their head to the principal. The last thing the principal wants to hear is that a parent went over their head to the superintendent. The last thing the superintendent wants to hear is that you went over their head to the school board.

    Disrupt and disregard the chain of command. If your news station is decent, it'll be higher up than the school board.

  9. #39
    Lallygag Moderator Geoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post


    Interesting enough, today in Japanese101 we were taught that a word meaning "Repeat what you just said?" seems very rude, and that instead you need to say "what is it?" because it sounds more delicate and polite.. even if you say the former word more sweetly than the latter.
    I was reading (I needed to for my job, at the time) the manuals issued to UK government officials if they need to write to the embassies of foreign countries in London to get tax and salary information for UK workers. In these manuals, it says

    "Be very careful with the choice of language, and especially avoid using a phrase that could unintentionally be interpreted as a declaration of war"

  10. #40
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    ^ I know all too well about using the chain of command even now, it is still the thing that military men and women abuse and misuse the most imo.

    The thing is, we're still unsure about our decision. Until we are sure, we will not go the press. We tried to tell them today to explain this to us, but they dismissed my mother (who is weak and sick and not in a position to argue or have any stress) home before she ever got to the point of it all. I think my dad is going to set an appointment of his own first. We want her punished, and we're appealing for a matter different from suspension, in-school suspension is what we are requesting.. but we aren't doing it to disagree with the school. We are doing it because privilages should be used the same way across the board, and taken the same way across the board.

    You can't just go to the school and say "My daughter did wrong so she should be different or special! just because everyone else did wrong!" .. I think our statement in this matter is "We agree with this situation, but why is all of this going on and you're picking an easy target?" when we approach it this way.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
    Halla74: Think your way through the world. Feel your way through life.

    Cimarron: maybe Prpl will be your girl-bud
    prplchknz: i don't like it

    In Search Of... ... Kiwi Sketch Art ... Dream Journal ... Kyuuei's Cook book ... Kyu's Tiny House Blog ... Minimalist Challenge ... Kyu's Savings Challenge

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