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  1. #1
    Member fishingdude's Avatar
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    Default An ISTJ's take on improving the education system

    Sorry if this is the wrong place to post this. Ok, I just want to throw out my ideas for improving our education system. I could be totally wrong, but I would like to hear your thoughts. I havenít read any other posts about this stuff, because Iím too lazy. So if Iím repeating whatís already been said, forgive me.
    Weíre all sponges when weíre young, so we should probably pump as much useful information into kids while they can really absorb it. Itís ridiculous to me that we are as ignorant as we are, when things could be so much better.

    Things I think should be made mandatory in schools worldwide in no particular order:
    1. Self Defense should be taught, maybe as some martial art.
    2. Religion should be a subject, taught unbiased. I believe half the world hates the other half just out of pure ignorance for what they think is believed. For instance, I donít know what those Middle Eastern dudes believe. Are they killing each other because they think their God tells them to? I have no idea. Maybe they have no idea what we think either.
    3. One worldwide language should be taught everywhere, then a local language as secondary. Another area that should eliminate problems between countries. We should all be on the same page here. Thereís no reason not to be.
    4. General everyday duties should bet taught too, i.e. balancing a check book, changing a tire, flipping a breaker. I donít believe that anything should be left up to parents as far as educating their kids. I think this because there are some really bad parents out there and their kids are ignorant to everyday things. There should be a redundancy in place where the parents are covered if they donít tell there kids something important. Todayís education system leaves too many areas uncovered.
    5. Basic survival skills should be taught. Yes it may be dumb in todayís world of technology, but it would be good to know these things if you ever find yourself in a situation you never thought you would be in.
    6. Some form of local law should be taught. I donít think government class covered that itís illegal to publicly walk around naked.
    7. Drivers Ed should be a school taught class too, and it should be at least a year long course. I donít think a six week course, or whatever it is now, is doing a thorough enough job.
    8. Vocabulary should be taught as a subject. We should know just about what every word means in our language.
    9. No general colleges, only technical colleges. No basics, just pure high quality information for what career path youíre choosing. You shouldnít have to take art when youíre going for a degree in accounting.
    10. Grades should be done away with because kids learn at different speeds. Instead, subjects should have levels. So one kid thatís 10 could be a level 6 in Math while another thatís 10 is at a level 20. Thereís no reason to hold bright kids back because the slower learners are having trouble. A kid should learn at their fastest speed. They should not be held back in any way.
    11. There should be a way to test kids early on, on how they learn best. Maybe an MBTI type test for kids. If this info was available to educators, kids could be taught the right way. For example, I learn best when I see it done or do it myself. Reading it in a book, didnít always sync in for me for quickly. So I either learned it later, or didnít try to learn it all.
    12. We should only have to be taught the basics of Math, Science, and History. I never have and never will use chemistry, calculus, or the knowledge that Lincoln was assassinated. That should be a higher, non-mandatory area of study.
    13. Cooking should be taught to everybody at least a year. People need to know how to make their own food, and they should be shown how to do it healthily.
    14. First Aid should be covered well. People should know what to do if an emergency should arise.
    15. The way the world is getting these days, I think there should be some kind of Environmental Appreciation class. I know it doesnít sound like much fun, but it would be good to know the consequences of doing the things we do to the world at a younger age.
    16. Morals should be taught. I work in a school environment and see bad kids all the time. They arenít born bad, they just have bad parents. Kids should be taught right and wrong.
    17. Dating, sex, and marriage should be taught to kids early on. These things shouldnít be treated as such a taboo subject area. Maybe if we were educated on this stuff in school, instead of the internet, we might not have as many early pregnancies and/or failed marriages.
    18. Self Discipline should also be taught. In my office there is a jar of candy. Every time I get up I get a piece, even though I really donít want one. I have no willpower whatsoever. Seeing that statistically most people are obese, Iím not the only one with little self discipline. Iím sure this can be taught just like anything else. I mean the military does, donít they?
    19. Sports should not be as big of a deal in schools as they are, and maybe they shouldnít be school related events at all. I know itís heresy, but I remember going to sporting events and seeing parents yelling like crazy people at other parents, kids, and referees. I used to get stressed out playing sports, because there was so much pressure coming from all sides. I donít know what the solution is, but it needs to change.
    20. All curriculum and lessons should be computer based. A student should not have to rely on a substitute or bad teacher.

    Sorry this is so long, but I think about this kind of stuff a lot. I need answers, and I value your feedback. If youíve got better ideas or more to add, letís hear it. Thanks

  2. #2
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    The only things on this list I can absolutely seriously agree with are ten and seventeen.

    Many of the others would have caused me to drop out of school immediately.

    Then again, I'm one of those people who think that it should be much easier to drop out of school.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  3. #3
    Reigning Bologna Princess Rajah's Avatar
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    As far as I can tell, I'd have taken seventeen classes a day - in Esperanto, natch, and with no regard to my emotional development or the teacher needing a sick day or, God forbid, a personal day - so I could go to Linguistics Vo-Tech. Younger me would have missed the Snickers bar, but it seems at least I could have made it all up with random sex.


    I... suppose. Yeah!

  4. #4
    Senior Member blanclait's Avatar
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    though idealistic and inplanted of course will improve the education system. But the biggest flaw why these points will be not put to use is this will increase expenses. And that means more taxes. And you know the rest.

    Some question to point out is...
    What is unbiased religion
    what is the one language that should be used worldwide. Such debate will never come to a conclusion, and regardless we will be left hanging.

    #20 states all lesson be computer based, but #11 saids it should cater to individuals' way of learning. Which is kind of contradiction.


    Like haphazard i too agree with #17. Which wont cost much money, and be effective as hell.


    The major change i see that needs to be implented in school is...
    Tell the kids that....
    a. grades are personal opinions based on the teacher toward the student. it is NOT a dead accurate depiction of the student's skill level.
    b. school's method is not the best method for everyone. Inability to follow its way is not your fault.
    c. School is actually a place of learning. And the aim should be to be able understand.

  5. #5
    Reigning Bologna Princess Rajah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blanclait View Post
    Like haphazard i too agree with #17. Which wont cost much money, and be effective as hell.
    Really? I find that unlikely.

    Decreased teen pregnancy rates are strongly correlated with contraception use. And contraception use among teenaged girls is strongly correlated with when they "do well in school, do not drop out of school, or have plans for education beyond high school." Teenaged girls themselves said they abstain from sexual activity because it would violate religious or moral beliefs (look at how well that works out...)

    Maybe it's not quite the "injection" theory you're positing - inject education, receive benefit of decreased sexual activity and pregnancy. It's markedly more complicated. Of course it's important to instruct students about the dangers of unprotected sex, but that's not exactly the cure-all course.

    And with regard to that list, cost of implementation is a huge impediment, but hardly the most glaring one - which is saying something.

    On the other hand, I'm impressed someone sat down to compose such a thorough list.


    I... suppose. Yeah!

  6. #6
    „Āę„āÉ„āď runvardh's Avatar
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    2, 3, 19, and 20 I could do with out. 10 would have been damn awesome for me growing up. The rest I got from extracurricular stuff, my dad, or watching the failures of my parents. I'll throw a strong backing to 17.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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  7. #7
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    Interesting ideas, no need to apologize when there's no offense. If it's in the wrong category the mods will relocate it. It's their job after all.

    Weíre all sponges when weíre young, so we should probably pump as much useful information into kids while they can really absorb it. Itís ridiculous to me that we are as ignorant as we are, when things could be so much better.
    Agree

    I'm going to break this down point by point.

    1. Self Defense should be taught, maybe as some martial art. - useful but not a must.
    2. Religion should be a subject, taught unbiased. - Depending on the age of the kids, you might run into problems. As you said, they're like sponges. They'll absorb everything without thought. On the topic of religion, EVERYBODY is biased. You have those who believe and those who doesn't. Then there's tens of religions out there. Whoever ends up teaching the course will unconsciously let their biases creep in.
    3. One worldwide language should be taught everywhere, then a local language as secondary. Another area that should eliminate problems between countries. We should all be on the same page here. Thereís no reason not to be. - language is one barrier, another is culture. The Quebecois here in Canada speak french... but there's general dislike between them and the French. Same goes for spanish speaking countries. Is universal language and culture possible? Also how do we decide upon which one will be selected? The fact is if people wants to quarrel, they'll find a means of doing so regardless.
    4. General everyday duties should bet taught too, i.e. balancing a check book, changing a tire, flipping a breaker. - Agree more or less that these are important skills to learn.
    5. Basic survival skills should be taught. -
    6. Some form of local law should be taught. I donít think government class covered that itís illegal to publicly walk around naked. - ummm that's common courtesies is it not? Much of this is covered in school, they're just not explicitly taught.
    7. Drivers Ed should be a school taught class too, and it should be at least a year long course. - What happened to those who do not wish to drive? Or people who've moved from a place where driving is uncommon? Where do they learn? A year long course seems unreasonable for them...
    8. Vocabulary should be taught as a subject. We should know just about what every word means in our language. - Basic vocab is taught in English class. The rest of it is per needs basis. There's millions of words out there. If you're an accountant, do you need to work what the procedure to remove your reproductive organs is called?
    9. No general colleges, only technical colleges. No basics, just pure high quality information for what career path youíre choosing. You shouldnít have to take art when youíre going for a degree in accounting. - YIKES! If everybody become completely specialized, there'll be virtually zero innovation in the world. I'll say the balanced is pushed far enough for "technical career based" learning as it is... we need more generalized schooling.
    10. Grades should be done away with because kids learn at different speeds. Instead, subjects should have levels. - Good for the gifted learners perhaps. This system doesn't account for social learning that takes place in school though. Things like teamwork, cooperation and friendship will likely disappear because nobody knows anybody else in class. There's no like-aged peers. Having the gifted take a few advance courses despite being in a lower grade I agree with. But not completely moving them out of the system.
    11. There should be a way to test kids early on, on how they learn best. Agree
    12. We should only have to be taught the basics of Math, Science, and History. - Calculus is not mandatory here in high school. However basics in chemistry, physics etc is as important as history. The broader your understanding of the world, the less likely you'll be taken in by propaganda.
    13. Cooking should be taught to everybody at least a year. - Do you not have home ed class in your education system? I thought that's a standard...
    14. First Aid should be covered well. - Agreed
    15. The way the world is getting these days, I think there should be some kind of Environmental Appreciation class. - No need for a class, just make a school wide project. The environmental awareness week is in March isn't it? Encourage them to clean up local parks etc, have bottle drives and walk or take public transit to school.
    16. Morals should be taught. - I think these things are learned by osmosis... how do you teach morals? Thou shall not kill? What about euthanesia? Moral behavior isn't black and white. Rules aren't useful, practice is.
    17. Dating, sex, and marriage should be taught to kids early on. - agreed.
    18. Self Discipline should also be taught. - The military teaches discipline... but that's discipline towards authority. Not the same. Self discipline comes from inside. I suppose you can show kids situations where long term benefits far outweigh short term ones. Then teach them to analyze pros and cons with the emphasis to always consider future consequences.
    19. Sports should not be as big of a deal in schools as they are, and maybe they shouldnít be school related events at all. - You're not much for team spirit are you? People aren't islands... It's not so much as the sports themselves as learning to work together as a group.
    20. All curriculum and lessons should be computer based. - Kids need to learn the nuisances of social interactions. A teacher is a role model for that. I do agree that teachers ought to pass some sort of standardized testing every few years to continue teaching.

  8. #8
    Member fishingdude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blanclait View Post
    What is unbiased religion
    what is the one language that should be used worldwide. Such debate will never come to a conclusion, and regardless we will be left hanging.
    What I meant by unbiased religion is to teach kids the subject of religion from a non-I'm trying to save your soul perspective. The purpose of this is to shed the light on dark areas that feeds people's needs to be predjudice. People are predjudice against things they are ignorant of, and we are ignorant of what other cultures truly believe.

    As far as choosing one language, the logical solution would be to choose the one that's most commonly known. If it's english, then a Japanese person would learn english and japanese.

    Quote Originally Posted by blanclait View Post
    #20 states all lesson be computer based, but #11 saids it should cater to individuals' way of learning. Which is kind of contradiction.
    You're right about this being a contradiction, I was throwing out ideas and I thought any one of them could improve on the current system. Not necessarily all of them or nothing.

    Quote Originally Posted by blanclait View Post
    The major change i see that needs to be implented in school is...
    Tell the kids that....
    a. grades are personal opinions based on the teacher toward the student. it is NOT a dead accurate depiction of the student's skill level.
    b. school's method is not the best method for everyone. Inability to follow its way is not your fault.
    c. School is actually a place of learning. And the aim should be to be able understand.
    I agree.

  9. #9
    Member fishingdude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rajah View Post
    And with regard to that list, cost of implementation is a huge impediment, but hardly the most glaring one - which is saying something.
    Yes, I agree this would be financially impossible to implement all at once. But if any one of these suggestions would improve on our current system, I don't see how adding one subject could be that hard to figure out. The way I see it is if there's a problem area, it should be fixed. Is it too much to hope that we should always be improving? What if Vulcans landed on Earth tomorrow and showed us our current system was all wrong? Would we say, "Sorry, Mr. Spock, that would be too hard to implement. We're already in too deep."?

  10. #10
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishingdude View Post
    What if Vulcans landed on Earth tomorrow and showed us our current system was all wrong? Would we say, "Sorry, Mr. Spock, that would be too hard to implement. We're already in too deep."?
    1) That would be the Vulcan's opinion

    and

    2) Yes.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

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