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Thread: Quadra behavior

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    You are what you love themightyfetus's Avatar
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    Default Quadra behavior

    Can someone explain to me in simple terms how each quadra is like? You know, like behavior, expression, vibe, etc. Just basic information about what makes each quadra itself. For instance--somebody told me that Deltas are unlikely to express their feelings much, Betas are dramatic, etc. I'd like to know more.
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    Quote Originally Posted by themightyfetus View Post
    Betas are dramatic
    Can confirm. Dramatics are a thing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by themightyfetus View Post
    Can someone explain to me in simple terms how each quadra is like? You know, like behavior, expression, vibe, etc. Just basic information about what makes each quadra itself. For instance--somebody told me that Deltas are unlikely to express their feelings much, Betas are dramatic, etc. I'd like to know more.
    Gamma is quite subdued. In an average gathering, there's hardly more than 5 people in it. Usually, the topics of conversation are future plans (how they are going to execute it), personal relations (what someone is to that person, likes and dislikes, trying to "read" a person to know what that person is like e.g. "This person is lazy/This person is genuine"), maximizing resources (talking about how things can be done better at work or with money) and heart to heart talks (empathizing with someone's situation).

    When they do discuss these topics, they are viewed with the lens of "what is it right now", "what can be done right now" and "how will it lead into the future".

    Generally, Gamma SFs read people and exercise "artificial" power (getting to know someone's strengths and weaknesses, and knowing when to press the weaknesses to do what they want), while Gamma NTs arrange the environment to better fit future needs (saving money for a rainy day, etc).

    For example, I frequently talk to @Hive about things like this. How things usually go about is me (Gamma SF), talking about somebody that I don't like, describing his/her personality traits (lazy, unambitious, whiny) (), and his actions (). To me, that person is unlikely to change because I've interacted with him/her and at that present moment he/she is like that. Hive would then remind me that that person *can* change, given enough time (). I would adamantly insist that that person would be like that, and that I'm too impatient to give that person a chance, because I don't want waste any more time ( leading, weak ) He would then suggest to me different ways to make the present moment less insufferable (), such as interacting when only necessary and the like.

    Then the conversation moves to something more practical-oriented. Just the other day we were talking about wages for part timers in our countries. Hive was talking about how he was willing to do back-to-back 10 hour shifts, sacrificing rest ( devaluing, oriented) because he had a vacation coming up and wanted enough money for the whole trip. I asked him how much wages usually are and he said it's around $15 baseline. I was so shocked, because here in Singapore, we don't have minimum wages, and because of that, the normal pay for part timers are around $6 an hour. He was quite shocked too, and asked how we lived, to which I answered, I don't know, since Singapore and Sweden are somewhat similar in costs ( and ).

    To summarize, Gamma is a quadra that favors an intimate atmosphere over a loud and engaging one, where members can share personal sentiments and future plans. The extroverts can seem somewhat introverted because of this, but they remain extroverts because of their orientation to objects as opposed to the fields between objects.
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    #KUWK Kierva's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kierva View Post
    If there's one word that I would use to describe Beta, it's "unity". No other quadra rallies its members as well as Beta, where the Beta NFs communicate their visions (hoping for world peace, freedom of speech for whatever cause they're championing, and ), hoping for others to feel the same, and the Beta STs doing most of the groundwork and using "raw" force (in comparison to Gamma's "artificial" force) to achieve those visions (organizing people in rallies, using force to thwart disruptors, and ).

    On a more microscopic level, the theme of "unity" still stands. Beta groups can be quite small or large, depending on the activity involved, and usually topics of conversation are stories with spectacles (a story where something spectacular or interesting happens, think front page news stories on Facebook or the newspaper, or even tabloids, ), how an interesting event or story progressed through time (how Sally met Tommy, what led them to be together, how they fought and end up breaking relations, basically any Korean drama you watch, ), testing and creating boundaries (breaking rules and seeing how far they can go, ), and discussing inconsistencies in systems or authorities ().

    When all of these topics are discussed, it is somewhat expected that members of the conversation let the speaker have their "spotlight", so that the speaker can enchant and evoke whatever feeling the speaker wants them to feel. Disruptors aren't well received, where members who share sentiments might gang up and shun them, and people who react with indifference to their stories will most likely be excluded from future conversations. Hence, the theme of "unity".

    For example, I was at Singapore's pride event earlier last month. Their theme was "Celebrating the freedom to love", and everyone wore pink as part of that. If you wore any other color, people might look at you weird if you actively try to participate, or just regard you as a passerby.

    Towards the climax of the event, everyone in pink gathered to form a huge dot, where speakers inspired the community () to be persistent and stay strong, and to stand up against opposition () so that in the future, they can live as free as possible, without needing an event to "Celebrate the freedom to love" (). Everyone in the crowd had a huge placard where everyone wrote their wishes, and I saw lot of messages asking to repeal an archaic law that criminalizes sodomy, but not consensual lesbian sex, with some even going as far to to describe and analyze how logically inconsistent the law is ().

    To summarize, Beta is a quadra that emphasizes unity through inspiration and visionary ( and respectively). To do this, they must organize people either forcefully or logically, where they may do so under an authority or point out how illogical their actions are in accordance to the given goal ( and , respectively). In this respect, the introverts can seem like extroverts because of how much they interact with people or objects, but they remain introverts because of their orientation to their visions or systems as opposed to the objects themselves.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Masokissed View Post
    Thank you for doing what I told you to do. You are such a good kid. I like my kids obedient.
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    #KUWK Kierva's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kierva View Post
    CC: @themightyfetus
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kierva View Post
    If there's one word that I would use to describe Beta, it's "unity". No other quadra rallies its members as well as Beta, where the Beta NFs communicate their visions (hoping for world peace, freedom of speech for whatever cause they're championing, and ), hoping for others to feel the same, and the Beta STs doing most of the groundwork and using "raw" force (in comparison to Gamma's "artificial" force) to achieve those visions (organizing people in rallies, using force to thwart disruptors, and ).

    On a more microscopic level, the theme of "unity" still stands. Beta groups can be quite small or large, depending on the activity involved, and usually topics of conversation are stories with spectacles (a story where something spectacular or interesting happens, think front page news stories on Facebook or the newspaper, or even tabloids, ), how an interesting event or story progressed through time (how Sally met Tommy, what led them to be together, how they fought and end up breaking relations, basically any Korean drama you watch, ), testing and creating boundaries (breaking rules and seeing how far they can go, ), and discussing inconsistencies in systems or authorities ().

    When all of these topics are discussed, it is somewhat expected that members of the conversation let the speaker have their "spotlight", so that the speaker can enchant and evoke whatever feeling the speaker wants them to feel. Disruptors aren't well received, where members who share sentiments might gang up and shun them, and people who react with indifference to their stories will most likely be excluded from future conversations. Hence, the theme of "unity".

    For example, I was at Singapore's pride event earlier last month. Their theme was "Celebrating the freedom to love", and everyone wore pink as part of that. If you wore any other color, people might look at you weird if you actively try to participate, or just regard you as a passerby.

    Towards the climax of the event, everyone in pink gathered to form a huge dot, where speakers inspired the community () to be persistent and stay strong, and to stand up against opposition () so that in the future, they can live as free as possible, without needing an event to "Celebrate the freedom to love" (). Everyone in the crowd had a huge placard where everyone wrote their wishes, and I saw lot of messages asking to repeal an archaic law that criminalizes sodomy, but not consensual lesbian sex, with some even going as far to to describe and analyze how logically inconsistent the law is ().

    To summarize, Beta is a quadra that emphasizes unity through inspiration and visionary ( and respectively). To do this, they must organize people either forcefully or logically, where they may do so under an authority or point out how illogical their actions are in accordance to the given goal ( and , respectively). In this respect, the introverts can seem like extroverts because of how much they interact with people or objects, but they remain introverts because of their orientation to their visions or systems as opposed to the objects themselves.
    ATM I'm listed as Gamma, and this description made me think because I have such a strong resistant reaction to atmospheres like this - a kind of cold, hard embarrassment. I'm not saying any of the following is right or good, but it's a behavior sample for the thread:

    While I can feel the sentiment around me and can choose to let go and be swept up in it, it's a non-spontaneous choice. My impulse is not to dissent so much as to just close a pair of emotional steel doors and either get away physically or distance myself in my mind and outward emotional expressions. I may think critical thoughts (or alternately, be privately moved in support of what's around me, maybe even holding back tears) and show resistant body language, but more so in the past than these days - as I've gotten older, I'm more aware of what's wrong with this behavior and make an effort to be polite about my lack of preference for these activities. But if others don't listen to my request to sit it out and try to pull me in, my restraint will be tested. Something in me is threatened by this stuff, and I can't put words to what it is. It could also have to do with my upbringing by two introverts, and how children's bullying (which I experienced) often is an abusive attempt at comedy. Imagine how a cat reacts when you try to put it in clothes.

    I'm also at risk of being this person without any actual ill intent:
    and people who react with [outward] indifference to their stories will most likely be excluded from future conversations.
    Being aware of how others will see that reaction (too bad it's usually hindsight), if my reaction to the "story" was good after all (other times, it's quite the opposite) and left me wanting to connect further with the source (sometimes it doesn't), I may return to that person later to share my thoughts about it one-on-one, expressing my support and belief in their goodness in serious terms that reflect how much thought I was actually giving the matter while I listened.

    It's a recurring behavior for me in general: visibly detaching from the group experience of an issue, but once I've processed it personally, conveying a strong and certain opinion on the matter to others in private and taking up silent action for this cause, at which I may work beyond what is collectively expected.

    I may come off as the person you know that you don't talk with as much as the others, who disappears for periods, and who seems like an ambivalent member of the friend group. Then, one day when you're venting about a problem, I'll look you directly in the eyes and tell you that you can get through this because you are among the kindest/bravest/most capable/[word] people I have encountered in my short lifetime. And BTW, here is a ridiculously sized offer of my resources to contribute, because [informed by my accumulated observations] I have absolute trust that your heart is in the right place with what you're trying to do. Post that, I'll probably fade off again because I'm a douche. But I'm always watching. And judging, I'll concede.

    In truth, there's very little in this world that I'm indifferent about.
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    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    ^I can relate to that Alaska.

    These descriptions are awesome, Kierva. I still don't think I'm ever going to be keyed into socionics in a defining way (but that's more, me not wanting to be tied up in any system anymore / my own views on the whole thing), but I have to say, your descriptions are super awesome and make waaaay more sense than anything I've read online. When I read online socionics descriptions it's just a bunch of nonsense to me. Perhaps it's that you're making it 'real'. Anyway. I definitely don't line up with Beta, I know that much.
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    Alright, we are gaining some traction!

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    ATM I'm listed as Gamma, and this description made me think because I have such a strong resistant reaction to atmospheres like this - a kind of cold, hard embarrassment. I'm not saying any of the following is right or good, but it's a behavior sample for the thread:
    Gotcha. Let's begin to analyze.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    While I can feel the sentiment around me and can choose to let go and be swept up in it, it's a non-spontaneous choice. My impulse is not to dissent so much as to just close a pair of emotional steel doors and either get away physically or distance myself in my mind and outward emotional expressions. I may think critical thoughts (or alternately, be privately moved in support of what's around me, maybe even holding back tears) and show resistant body language, but more so in the past than these days - as I've gotten older, I'm more aware of what's wrong with this behavior and make an effort to be polite about my lack of preference for these activities. But if others don't listen to my request to sit it out and try to pull me in, my restraint will be tested. Something in me is threatened by this stuff, and I can't put words to what it is. It could also have to do with my upbringing by two introverts, and how children's bullying (which I experienced) often is an abusive attempt at comedy. Imagine how a cat reacts when you try to put it in clothes.
    This is a very good example of dominance. The concise, official description of is "internal statics of fields", where the person using this function is assessing the field between herself and what is happening, so that she may form an "attitude" or "opinion" about it. Because it is static, this judgment is unlikely to change, and hence why you see descriptions talk about ethics and values.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    I'm also at risk of being this person without any actual ill intent:

    Being aware of how others will see that reaction (too bad it's usually hindsight), if my reaction to the "story" was good after all (other times, it's quite the opposite) and left me wanting to connect further with the source (sometimes it doesn't), I may return to that person later to share my thoughts about it one-on-one, expressing my support and belief in their goodness in serious terms that reflect how much thought I was actually giving the matter while I listened.
    This is a good example of preferring over , because where emotions are expressive and fleeting, wants to make the emotion heartfelt and constant.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    It's a recurring behavior for me in general: visibly detaching from the group experience of an issue, but once I've processed it personally, conveying a strong and certain opinion on the matter to others in private and taking up silent action for this cause, at which I may work beyond what is collectively expected.
    I'd like to invite you to read "Gamma - The Complex of Tied Hands", where the writer mentions that "Alpha Quadra kills by word, while Gamma quadra avenges itself by action – they will take something heavy into their hands and then adequately react in response. Alpha Quadra will consider its aggression to be inappropriate and unwarranted – they will loudly yell and shout, and call for help (as here nobody will try to shut their mouth) but Gamma Quadra won't get stopped by the cries of their offenders. The important thing for Gamma types is that right now their hands are not tied – and they can act and directly deal with their opposition here and now."

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    I may come off as the person you know that you don't talk with as much as the others, who disappears for periods, and who seems like an ambivalent member of the friend group. Then, one day when you're venting about a problem, I'll look you directly in the eyes and tell you that you can get through this because you are among the kindest/bravest/most capable/[word] people I have encountered in my short lifetime. And BTW, here is a ridiculously sized offer of my resources to contribute, because [informed by my accumulated observations] I have absolute trust that your heart is in the right place with what you're trying to do. Post that, I'll probably fade off again because I'm a douche. But I'm always watching. And judging, I'll concede.
    From this, I would wager that you would rather be a friend that people cry to and count on listening, than a friend that would laugh along with and go MIA when the going gets tough. I think this is a good example of and working together, where 's ethics and values stays constant despite whatever hardship or tough situation that tests your will with . I believe that the most ultimate form of devotion is the manifestation of and , and that is why I love Gamma quadra so much.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    In truth, there's very little in this world that I'm indifferent about.
    Still waters run deep, and that is why I hold off judgment until I've truly known a person (democratic trait).

    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post
    ^I can relate to that Alaska.

    These descriptions are awesome, Kierva. I still don't think I'm ever going to be keyed into socionics in a defining way (but that's more, me not wanting to be tied up in any system anymore / my own views on the whole thing), but I have to say, your descriptions are super awesome and make waaaay more sense than anything I've read online. When I read online socionics descriptions it's just a bunch of nonsense to me. Perhaps it's that you're making it 'real'. Anyway. I definitely don't line up with Beta, I know that much.
    Thank you, and the pleasure is mine.

    As I've said before, a lot of socionics is just decontextualized theory. It's no problem for users, where consistent logical links are valued, but what about myself, a valuer who learns mostly through examples and evidence? What I've written is something that I've personally experienced, and it takes a lot of time to contextualize and understand how these events fit within my knowledge. I'm glad that you guys find it informative and understandable, because that was my main goal from the start of this thread. Maybe, for the benefit of other readers, can this thread be stickied or even put into an article format (CC: @EJCC, @highlander)?

    As an aside, I'll be writing something about Alpha and Delta soon. I've put these two off because I'm not that familiar with them, but I'll try my best to make whatever knowledge I have as simple to understand and factually correct as possible.
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