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Thread: The PoLR Thread

  1. #1
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    Default The PoLR Thread

    It's time to flesh out the Socionics sub-forum, and perhaps even work our way to the other functions of Model A so that we can allocate resources to one thread instead of having to scavenge for resources in thirty different places on the internet, so let's begin with the PoLR because it is easy to recognize (I think?).

    For those who do not know,

    IxTp - PoLR Fe
    ExTp - PoLR Fi
    INxj - PoLR Se
    ENxj - PoLR Si
    ESxj - PoLR Ni
    ISxj - PoLR Ne
    ExFp - PoLR Ti
    IxFp - PoLR Te

    The PoLR (Point of Least Resistance) is the 4th function for any type, (for example, ILI = Ni - Te - Si - Fe) and is thus in the Super-Ego block, meaning that criticism to this function will be taken especially harshly and that no matter how hard you try and improve it, you will always give up or fail. Some regard this function as a "blind-spot" for each of the types (ILI is blind to social courtesies, SEE is blind to their own contradictions (Expat's description on 16types)).

    So, post how you think your PoLR manifests itself in your life, and if you have met your Supervising type, tell us how they hit your PoLR, that way we can pool information together and at the same time have people much more skilled in Socionics than I am tell people that they are typed incorrectly and/or that certain information people have provided is NTR.

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    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    I was bullied by Se-doms or aux (probably xSTPs) in high school... It wounded my psyche and lowered my self esteem...

    I am physically attracted to women high in Se...

    I am afraid of heights... High temperatures make me drowsy... Skin in sensitive to sunlight... High doses of Se such as rollercosters and other recreational machinery creates anxiety in me...

    Lean muscle ratio is relatively low...

    My personal theory is that Se is related to "id" rather than super-ego though...just as a sidenote...


    See Post #6
    Last edited by yeghor; 04-12-2014 at 02:38 PM. Reason: Bolded - Strikethru...

  3. #3
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yeghor View Post
    I was bullied by Se-doms (probably xSTPs) in high school... It wounded my psyche and lowered my self esteem...

    I am physically attracted to women high in Se...

    I am afraid of heights... High temperatures make me drowsy... Skin in sensitive to sunlight... High doses of Se such as rollercosters and other recreational machinery creates anxiety in me...

    Lean muscle ratio is relatively low...

    My personal theory is that Se is related to "id" rather than ego though...just as a sidenote...
    Assuming you test as IEI (MBTI INFJ), you would be an INFp and Se would be under the super-id and specifically under the DS function (or suggestive).

    Apologies, but your personal theory doesn't apply in the construct of Socionics, as in the system every type's first 4 functions are known as the mental functions and are therefore utilized consciously. Therefore, an IEI consciously uses Ni and Fe, while also only engaging in the super-ego block with conscious effort, meaning that your functions of Si and Te are completely dependent on where your attention is focused. The other 4 functions are put in the unconscious category, where there is absolutely no control over these functions when we use them, which for the IEI would be indicative of Se, Ti, Ne, and Fi.

    Also, attraction to Se can be indicative of duality and supervision at the same time, as the supervisee often feels attracted to the supervisor, whose strongest point is the quality that is most admired by the supervisee.

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    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    Assuming you test as IEI (MBTI INFJ), you would be an INFp and Se would be under the super-id and specifically under the DS function (or suggestive).

    Apologies, but your personal theory doesn't apply in the construct of Socionics, as in the system every type's first 4 functions are known as the mental functions and are therefore utilized consciously. Therefore, an IEI consciously uses Ni and Fe, while also only engaging in the super-ego block with conscious effort, meaning that your functions of Si and Te are completely dependent on where your attention is focused. The other 4 functions are put in the unconscious category, where there is absolutely no control over these functions when we use them, which for the IEI would be indicative of Se, Ti, Ne, and Fi.
    OK... you already know the thread I mentioned about it so I'll not reiterate it here...

    On what do they base the conscious or unconscious nature of accessibility of the functions and a part of them being the super-ego block?...Brain scans or smt?

    And what constitutes the id block then?

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    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yeghor View Post
    OK... you already know the thread I mentioned about it so I'll not reiterate it here...

    On what do they base the conscious or unconscious nature of accessibility of the functions and a part of them being the super-ego block?...Brain scans or smt?

    And what constitutes the id block then?
    I do not know what evidence they base their research on, but that does not mean your theory which also lacks evidence is superior to it.

    Primarily it seems that they base it off of the analysis of several individuals inclusive of one type. ILIs, for instance, have to consciously make an effort to appeal to social norms and express emotions, there is no unconscious drive to express emotions for these individuals, and about the same applies to the role function of Si, where they have to consciously make an effort to be detail-oriented, to be physically healthy, etc., and again there is no unconscious drive to do so; therefore, criticism to this area hurts because the individuals are making a conscious effort to buttress these functions and their work is seen as failing, leaving some people to simply give up on improving these areas entirely.

    The id block consists of the opposite attitudes of the ego block functions. The IEI, for instance, has Ni-Fe in the Ego block (the lead and creative function) and Ne-Fi in the id block (the ignoring and demonstrative).

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    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    I do not know what evidence they base their research on, but that does not mean your theory which also lacks evidence is superior to it.

    Primarily it seems that they base it off of the analysis of several individuals inclusive of one type. ILIs, for instance, have to consciously make an effort to appeal to social norms and express emotions, there is no unconscious drive to express emotions for these individuals, and about the same applies to the role function of Si, where they have to consciously make an effort to be detail-oriented, to be physically healthy, etc., and again there is no unconscious drive to do so; therefore, criticism to this area hurts because the individuals are making a conscious effort to buttress these functions and their work is seen as failing, leaving some people to simply give up on improving these areas entirely.

    The id block consists of the opposite attitudes of the ego block functions. The IEI, for instance, has Ni-Fe in the Ego block (the lead and creative function) and Ne-Fi in the id block (the ignoring and demonstrative).
    So MBTI INFJ = Socionics INFp = IEI

    (These nomenclature need to be unified in a standard one... It feels like the dihcotomy between metric and imperial systems)

    Oh I guess I misunderstood in my earlier reply then... So my socionics type is INFp and my PoLR is Ni Fe Te Si ? And Te-Si form my super ego block in this setup?

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    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yeghor View Post
    So MBTI INFJ = Socionics INFp = IEI

    (These nomenclature need to be unified in a standard one... It feels like the dihcotomy between metric and imperial systems)

    Oh I guess I misunderstood in my earlier reply then... So my socionics type is INFp and my PoLR is Ni Fe Te Si ? And Te-Si form my super ego block in this setup?
    No. Assuming you are an INFp, your PoLR would be Te. Your Super-Ego block would be Si, Te. (The function order for the mental block is Lead, Creative, Role, PoLR (also known as the Vulnerable function))

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    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    No. Assuming you are an INFp, your PoLR would be Te. Your Super-Ego block would be Si, Te. (The function order for the mental block is Lead, Creative, Role, PoLR (also known as the Vulnerable function)
    Something's funny about the function order wrt MBTI... The function descriptions are the same as those in MBTI aren't they? Then:

    So the closest type to MBTI INFJ = Socionics INFp -> and the function order is different as Ni Fe Si Te where:

    Ni and Fe are referred to as ego, Si and Te are referred to as super ego... but this super ego has a different purpose than the Freudian super ego I guess...

    And also the 5th and 6th functions according to socionics Se and Ti are referred to as super-id (above id?) and the 7th and 8th, Ne and Fi are referred to as id but this is different than Freudian id?

    So the conscious functions for MBTI INFJ and socionics INFp are different where only the first 2 are common...

    And Path of least resistance (which resides in the superego in this model) for INFp = Te (i.e. the 4th function in this model)...

    How does Te affect me... When someone uses Te on me, I get irritated cause I am accustomed to Fe kind of communication... Te communication feels like cold...

    Actually I made this thread earlier about Te...you can go thru it once more to see if there's anything of use...

    Does the order of functions in socionics model sound true to you though? I don't have any Ti according to that model?

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    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    And I feel much inferior when it comes to my lack of Se...rather than Te... When angered, I can raise my voice and use Te (rather easily)...

  10. #10
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yeghor View Post
    Something's funny about the function order wrt MBTI... The function descriptions are the same as those in MBTI aren't they? Then:

    So the closest type to MBTI INFJ = Socionics INFp -> and the function order is different as Ni Fe Si Te where:

    Ni and Fe are referred to as ego, Si and Te are referred to as super ego... but this super ego has a different purpose than the Freudian super ego I guess...

    And also the 5th and 6th functions according to socionics Se and Ti are referred to as super-id (above id?) and the 7th and 8th, Ne and Fi are referred to as id but this is different than Freudian id?

    So the conscious functions for MBTI INFJ and socionics INFp are different where only the first 2 are common...

    And Path of least resistance (which resides in the superego in this model) for INFp = Te (i.e. the 4th function in this model)...

    How does Te affect me... When someone uses Te on me, I get irritated cause I am accustomed to Fe kind of communication... Te communication feels like cold...

    Actually I made this thread earlier about Te...you can go thru it once more to see if there's anything of use...

    Does the order of functions in socionics model sound true to you though? I don't have any Ti according to that model?
    The order of the functions is not represented with strength -> weakness EDIT: sequentially.

    Ego Block - Strong, Valued, Conscious
    Super-Ego Block - Weak, Unvalued, Conscious
    Super-Id Block - Weak, Valued, Unconscious
    Id Block - Strong, Unvalued, Unconscious

    Also, Te would usually be perceived from the standpoint of an individual with Te PoLR as strong and admirable, though in cases where Te Ego types berate the Te PoLR person, they are seen as somewhat cruel and imposing. The point is that types with Te PoLR do not like it when they are criticized for not being objective and realistic, something they try to work on but ultimately fail at.

    Usually the imposers would be conflictors while the more admirable ones are supervisors.

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