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Socionics SFs in brief

sulfit

New member
Joined
Aug 5, 2010
Messages
495
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
6w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/so
As for Gamma SFs here are some representative videos and examples:



 

infinite

New member
Joined
Mar 19, 2014
Messages
565
MBTI Type
ISTP
Enneagram
~8
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Ti isn't "logic" per se. It's an instinctive sense of the more sensible and fitting arrangement, but fleshing out what you think, formal logic, providing arguments and proofs, etc. any type can do this. EIIs and IEEs who train themselves in logical fallacies and logical discourse become very good at it despite having weak Ti. This means the Tx functions and "logic" are not the same thing.

OK... then that instinctive sense I have is socionics Ti, fine.
 

sulfit

New member
Joined
Aug 5, 2010
Messages
495
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
6w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/so
more gamma SF music, notice unconstrained freedom of movements (Se)



 
Joined
Dec 7, 2008
Messages
271
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
7w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Ti isn't "logic" per se. It's an instinctive sense of the more sensible and fitting arrangement, but fleshing out what you think, formal logic, providing arguments and proofs, etc. any type can do this. EIIs and IEEs who train themselves in logical fallacies and logical discourse become very good at it despite having weak Ti. This means the Tx functions and "logic" are not the same thing.

Well, Logic is External rather than Internal. It's not so much an instinct from within as an ability to perceive and work with the structures and contradictions that appear in our environment. As such, the laws and systems of formal logic would count as Ti too. It makes sense to say that a Logical type would be able to start working with and manipulating such a system more quickly and confidently than an Ethical type.
 
S

Stansmith

Guest
Ha, going off of [MENTION=10791]sulfit[/MENTION] 's idea..

SEE


ESI

 

infinite

New member
Joined
Mar 19, 2014
Messages
565
MBTI Type
ISTP
Enneagram
~8
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Well, Logic is External rather than Internal. It's not so much an instinct from within as an ability to perceive and work with the structures and contradictions that appear in our environment. As such, the laws and systems of formal logic would count as Ti too. It makes sense to say that a Logical type would be able to start working with and manipulating such a system more quickly and confidently than an Ethical type.

So these systems of formal logic can be approached both from instinctual Ti and whatever kind of Te?

I find it interesting that my instinctual version of Ti usually matches formal logic really well. My proof for that is that I excelled at mathematics when in school. So anyway, the point isn't bragging here but the fact that formal logic does have something to do with this kind of instinctual logic.

And I guess it's easy to explain, after all, formal logic is just a refined version of our thinking capabilities.

And honestly, if an IEE can learn formal logic, they do have those capabilities somewhere in there. Just not instinctual or what? How does socionics explain that?
 
Joined
Dec 7, 2008
Messages
271
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
7w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
So these systems of formal logic can be approached both from instinctual Ti and whatever kind of Te?

I find it interesting that my instinctual version of Ti usually matches formal logic really well. My proof for that is that I excelled at mathematics when in school. So anyway, the point isn't bragging here but the fact that formal logic does have something to do with this kind of instinctual logic.

And I guess it's easy to explain, after all, formal logic is just a refined version of our thinking capabilities.

And honestly, if an IEE can learn formal logic, they do have those capabilities somewhere in there. Just not instinctual or what? How does socionics explain that?

Well, Te would be something different (also external). It would be the methodologies in the world. Pretty much any working process.

The formal definitions are these:

Ti = External Statics of Fields i.e. truths, axioms, laws.

Te = External Dynamics of Objects i.e. methods, processes, mechanisms.


Ah, well everyone has access to all 8 aspects of information. It's just that when your IM Element is 1-Dimensional (like the vulnerable function), you can only use it at its most basic level. It would be hard work for an IEE to learn Formal Logic but its possible through rote memory and practising. Nevertheless, when put in a new situation, they will be unlikely to put this knowledge to adequate use. They may find themselves out of their depth because the logic they have learned will still be very difficult to manipulate.
 

infinite

New member
Joined
Mar 19, 2014
Messages
565
MBTI Type
ISTP
Enneagram
~8
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Well, Te would be something different (also external). It would be the methodologies in the world. Pretty much any working process.

The formal definitions are these:

Ti = External Statics of Fields i.e. truths, axioms, laws.

Te = External Dynamics of Objects i.e. methods, processes, mechanisms.


Ah, well everyone has access to all 8 aspects of information. It's just that when your IM Element is 1-Dimensional (like the vulnerable function), you can only use it at its most basic level. It would be hard work for an IEE to learn Formal Logic but its possible through rote memory and practising. Nevertheless, when put in a new situation, they will be unlikely to put this knowledge to adequate use. They may find themselves out of their depth because the logic they have learned will still be very difficult to manipulate.

Alright. Hm based on how hard it seems to engage e.g. Fi for me, I can only say I have high respect for those IEEs who do learn that stuff.
 
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