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  1. #21
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    The opinions of a professional society only matter if the individual members took the time to read the primary sources. How many members of the AAAS actually took the time to read the research on fracking? The fact that a mere 39% of them support fracking tells me that very few of them took the time to research the issue. If 87% truly believe that climate change is "mostly due to human activity", then how do you explain climate change 10 million years ago, lol? Do these people believe there was no climate change 10 million years ago?
    There is a difference between 'mostly' and 'entirely'. There's also a difference between 'is' and 'was'.

    It's this sort of thing that screws with the layman understanding of science. Technicalities matter.
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  2. #22
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Also it's because of scientists that we have an idea what climate was like 10 million years ago in the first place. Do you really think they would make this mistake now?

    It's more like this goes without saying and I'm sure they'd presume you can figure it out by what makes sense. Of course they don't believe there was no climate change 10 million years ago, but they shouldn't have to say. There's no mistake that has been cleverly revealed, they just simply take obviousness for granted. I mean seriously, who underestimates that much?
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  3. #23
    deplorable basketcase Tellenbach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles
    Of course they don't believe there was no climate change 10 million years ago, but they shouldn't have to say.
    So are they suggesting that those forces which affected climage change 10 million years ago are no longer present or that they pale in comparison to humanity's use of fossil fuels? It strikes me as odd that anyone would claim that humanity was mostly responsible for climate change when we've had climate change for millions of years.

    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles
    There's no mistake that has been cleverly revealed, they just simply take obviousness for granted. I mean seriously, who underestimates that much?
    Not sure what point you're trying to make here. Who's underestimating what?
    Senator Rand Paul is alive because of modern medicine and because his attacker punches like a girl.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    A recent poll indicates that people are afraid to eat anything with DNA in it. So what.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”
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  5. #25
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Over millions of years hominids have been naturally selected to function well in a world of our size. But scientists have been able to learn about a world far bigger than our size in Relativity, and to learn about a world far smaller than our size in Quantum Mechanics.

    And we have not been selected to function in the world of the very big or the very small. So we have an intuitive understanding of the our size world, but only a counter-intuitive understanding of the worlds of the very big or the very small.

    So the general public cling to common sense rather than scientific sense.

    In other words, the general public cling to what we have achieved through natural selection over millions of years, rather than what scientists have discovered yesterday.
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  6. #26
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    A recent poll indicates that people are afraid to eat anything with DNA in it. So what.
    I remember seeing this.
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  7. #27
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    A recent poll indicates that people are afraid to eat anything with DNA in it. So what.
    DNA sounds like a chemical because it is. And if we don't know what a particular chemical is, it makes sense not to eat it.

    But we achieve superiority by sneering at the common sense of the general public.

  8. #28
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    Over millions of years hominids have been naturally selected to function well in a world of our size. But scientists have been able to learn about a world far bigger than our size in Relativity, and to learn about a world far smaller than our size in Quantum Mechanics.

    And we have not been selected to function in the world of the very big or the very small. So we have an intuitive understanding of the our size world, but only a counter-intuitive understanding of the worlds of the very big or the very small.

    So the general public cling to common sense rather than scientific sense.

    In other words, the general public cling to what we have achieved through natural selection over millions of years, rather than what scientists have discovered yesterday.
    This is the first sensible thing you've posted!

    Very true. (I know, truth has no measure... Just screwing with people.)

    Why believe what is new over what has worked before?
    Thinking about it there rarely is adequate justification other than "science says". Actually one of the reasons I'm trying my brain on the quantum end. Mind you it does help when you have chapters like "time slows down when you're chasing squirrels".
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  9. #29
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    So are they suggesting that those forces which affected climage change 10 million years ago are no longer present or that they pale in comparison to humanity's use of fossil fuels? It strikes me as odd that anyone would claim that humanity was mostly responsible for climate change when we've had climate change for millions of years.
    Yes they believe that humans have caused more change since the Renaissance and industrial revolution than the entire natural change which has occurred during the entire lifespan of the earth.

    Edit: and it's not so much how much change there is, but how fast it is happening. Basically it looks like this:


    There's a bit of slow temperature change over a long time but when humans come along, it just went FOOM. We're still talking small changes but it happens incredibly fast compared to what is natural.

  10. #30
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    @Tellenbach

    Also look at it like this. If you have a balloon that goes around the earth in one day vs a rocket that only goes halfway around the earth in one second, the rocket is the vehicle that has more change because it is doing more in any given frame than the balloon is, even though the balloon got further by simply travelling for longer.

    Or like this: Bob moves 20 bricks in 2 minutes and Alice moves 20 bricks in 1 minute. Who causes the most change? It is not equal. Alice causes the most change because if you give Bob only 1 minute, Alice will move twice as many bricks. This does not change if you put Bob on a bigger pile. If Bob moves a million bricks at his usual rate and Alice only moves a hundred, Alice still does the most change even though Bob moves the most bricks.

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