User Tag List

View Poll Results: Do you support eugenics?

Voters
38. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    8 21.05%
  • No

    30 78.95%
First 41213141516 Last

Results 131 to 140 of 200

  1. #131
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    MBTI
    ENFJ
    Enneagram
    1w2 sp/so
    Socionics
    EIE Fe
    Posts
    7,980

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by collierm48 View Post
    . Yeah you can. .
    Not always. Genetics is not as simple as everyone tends to think. The complexity of genetics is enormous and thinking in terms of individual genes doesn't work in this context (as he pointed out).
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari


  2. #132
    Senior Member TheCheeseBurgerKing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Posts
    369

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    Not always. Genetics is not as simple as everyone tends to think. The complexity of genetics is enormous and thinking in terms of individual genes doesn't work in this context (as he pointed out).
    Please give me one genetic advantage that the mentally handicapped have over the non-mentally handicapped.

  3. #133
    Permabanned
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    MBTI
    ISTJ
    Enneagram
    huh
    Posts
    67

    Default

    Most people don't TEND to think about it at all. I'm sure by making it seem cloudy and mysterious you can deter a good many curious people.

  4. #134
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    MBTI
    ENFJ
    Enneagram
    1w2 sp/so
    Socionics
    EIE Fe
    Posts
    7,980

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by collierm48 View Post
    Please give me one genetic advantage that the mentally handicapped have over the non-mentally handicapped.
    To answer your question, there isn't one.

    However, you're not understanding the point several of us are trying to make here. In the future, we very well may be able to point select and eliminate genetic disorders that have mental handicaps associated with them on a fetus, blastocyst, or something along those lines, but that's not eugenics, that's gene therapy on an individual. That itself is fine, and would be a fantastic scientific innovation.

    To attempt to clear all the genes that could potentially lead to the disorder not appearing anymore from a population would be enormously difficult, and could have drastic consequenses we can not predict. On a related and interesting note, many of these such diseases are recessive in nature. Oddly, having 1/2 a copy of the disease (i.e. an unaffected carrier) can actually be a good thing for the individual and give them strengths. Some of these genes could have a purpose, or have a already documented purpose.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari


  5. #135
    Senior Member TheCheeseBurgerKing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Posts
    369

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    To attempt to clear all the genes that could potentially lead to the disorder not appearing anymore from a population would be enormously difficult, and could have drastic consequenses we can not predict. On a related and interesting note, many of these such diseases are recessive in nature. Oddly, having 1/2 a copy of the disease (i.e. an unaffected carrier) can actually be a good thing for the individual and give them strengths. Some of these genes could have a purpose, or have a already documented purpose.

    Well that's interesting.

    "Oddly, having 1/2 a copy of the disease (i.e. an unaffected carrier) can actually be a good thing for the individual and give them strengths."

    ->Could you give me and example of this?

  6. #136

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by collierm48 View Post
    . Yeah you can. .
    LOL. I am not sure now if you are serious or not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    Not always. Genetics is not as simple as everyone tends to think. The complexity of genetics is enormous and thinking in terms of individual genes doesn't work in this context (as he pointed out).
    ^This.

    If people are actually interesting in learning or having a serious debate instead of ... whatever this is.
    There is a concept of gene penetrance that would be an interesting read about.

    Our DNA gets transcribed to RNA which gets translated to Proteins. It is the proteins that form the complex machinery that make up the even more complicated machinery that makes us, us.

    A trait, even one where we can isolate the genes for may be unexpectedly linked to other traits.

    Keep in mind that sickle cell anemia protects against malaria. If malaria was as wide spread in the whole world as it is in some developing nations, sickle cell would be an advantage.

    I believe it is low probability to find ways to eliminate traits (at the 10% of population level) that won't reduce the overall strength of our species. Let alone te moral arguments against mass genocide at that level.

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

  7. #137
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    MBTI
    ENFJ
    Enneagram
    1w2 sp/so
    Socionics
    EIE Fe
    Posts
    7,980

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by collierm48 View Post
    Ah, I see. Good point.

    "Oddly, having 1/2 a copy of the disease (i.e. an unaffected carrier) can actually be a good thing for the individual and give them strengths."

    ->Could you give me and example of this?
    Sickle cell anemia. It protects against maleria. A heterozygous (one good copy, one bad copy) individual has resistance to malaria, and suffer few (if any) complications from the disease. Where as a homozygous individual (two bad copies) is very resistant, but can have nasty complications from it.

    There are many more, this is just the first one I was able to find, and it's one where the evidence and data is cut and dry. When you start getting into mental disorders things become a bit more muddle due to the nature of, well, mental disorders.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari


  8. #138
    Senior Member TheCheeseBurgerKing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Posts
    369

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    Sickle cell anemia. It protects against maleria. A heterozygous (one good copy, one bad copy) individual has resistance to malaria, and suffer few (if any) complications from the disease. Where as a homozygous individual (two bad copies) is very resistant, but can have nasty complications from it.

    There are many more, this is just the first one I was able to find, and it's one where the evidence and data is cut and dry. When you start getting into mental disorders things become a bit more muddle due to the nature of, well, mental disorders.
    I get you now. It's almost as if sickle cell anemia is one end of an extreme. Unfortunately, sickle cell is the negative end of the spectrum.

    Obviously, genetic manipulation (or whatever the official name for it is) is extremely complicated. A lot of time needs to be invested into learning the subject. Its too big of a thing to speculate on and make a bold move.

    @ygolo

    I'm dead serious. There is not one competitive advantage that they have. If there was, the mentally handicapped would be reproducing.

  9. #139
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,568

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by collierm48 View Post
    Please give me one genetic advantage that the mentally handicapped have over the non-mentally handicapped.
    Just what do you consider to be "mentally handicapped"?

    Quote Originally Posted by collierm48 View Post
    Yeah, I'm dead serious. There is not one competitive advantage that they have. If they did, the mentally handicapped would be reproducing.
    The presence of gay people has been shown to have evolutionary benefit, yet their reproduction rate is very low compared with others. One needs to look at competitive advantage at the level of a species, not an individual.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  10. #140
    Senior Member TheCheeseBurgerKing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Posts
    369

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Just what do you consider to be "mentally handicapped"?
    Down's syndrome, Retardation, Autism....

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    The presence of gay people has been shown to have evolutionary benefit.
    How?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    One needs to look at competitive advantage at the level of a species, not an individual.
    Well, one should look at it as a whole, but agreed for the most part.

Similar Threads

  1. [ESTJ] What do you think of ESTJs?
    By JediM05 in forum The SJ Guardhouse (ESFJ, ISFJ, ESTJ, ISTJ)
    Replies: 177
    Last Post: 11-15-2013, 11:18 PM
  2. [NT] NT rationals, a question! What do you think?
    By Viva_Hate in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 27
    Last Post: 04-06-2008, 07:09 PM
  3. What do you think about?
    By proteanmix in forum General Psychology
    Replies: 50
    Last Post: 04-06-2008, 01:48 AM
  4. Time to re-evaluate myself (again?) - what do you think I am/could be?
    By TenebrousReflection in forum What's my Type?
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 03-18-2008, 07:22 AM
  5. So...what do you think?
    By Oberon in forum The Fluff Zone
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 09-19-2007, 12:19 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO