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  1. #11
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    It makes sense. You are an Apple customer. Tech-savvy folks generally won't touch an Apple product.

    I can't believe you are still using one with 10 years of experience. It's a piece of shit with a spit-shine.

    People never fail to amaze me. Don't you consider that if you don't understand the specs, you are getting had? I can't buy anything without understanding the specs, because I want the best value I can get.
    I have both and quite frankly, enjoy both. Have you owned a Mac? Or are you slamming them like I have heard a hundred other PC'ers do? For a while, I was a PC snob, mostly because of your value argument above and because some Apple folks can tend to present as Apple snobs, like they've bought something that makes them better than the "average" person. And that annoyed me. I used a Mac back in 1998 for a year and grew to enjoy them, but for 10 years after that, didn't own one of my own until I bought my MacBook Pro 2 years ago.

    As a computer programmer, which I believe that makes me more "tech-savvy" than the average person, I can honestly say that my PC and my Mac fill specific niches that the other fails to fill. I tend to do most of my work and coding on the PC. Primarily because I like being at a desk for that, with papers and what-not strewn about, and since I purchased all my software originally for PC, I keep upgrading it to that platform. I have a Dell XPS that's a couple of years old now, but specced out very, very nicely.

    The MacBook Pro however is the machine I do my writing on and most of my pleasure-computing. To say it is a finely crafted tool would be accurate. Everything about it is geared to be pleasing to the eye and hand. The monitor is more gorgeous on the laptop than my other comp, and it's got a lovely screen as it is. The Mac display shows no pixelation or lack of ability to keep up with the data rate when playing any DVD, and the colors are sublime, not harsh. The sound is superior than any other laptop I have owned. No tinny little speakers in this machine. Watching a movie is on it is enjoyable. Granted I have a 17" monitor, because I don't want to squint at any small screen anymore. It has crashed .. once? My PC regularly needs attention to keep crap spyware and malware from affecting it.

    Specs are one thing. Pleasure is another. From what I have heard CV say she wants out of the machine, I would recommend the Mac. It will bring her more than sufficient power and a lot of happiness while she is using it.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
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    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  2. #12
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    I have both and quite frankly, enjoy both. Have you owned a Mac? Or are you slamming them like I have heard a hundred other PC'ers do? For a while, I was a PC snob, mostly because of your value argument above and because some Apple folks can tend to present as Apple snobs, like they've bought something that makes them better than the "average" person. And that annoyed me. I used a Mac back in 1998 for a year and grew to enjoy them, but for 10 years after that, didn't own one of my own until I bought my MacBook Pro 2 years ago.

    As a computer programmer, which I believe that makes me more "tech-savvy" than the average person, I can honestly say that my PC and my Mac fill specific niches that the other fails to fill. I tend to do most of my work and coding on the PC. Primarily because I like being at a desk for that, with papers and what-not strewn about, and since I purchased all my software originally for PC, I keep upgrading it to that platform. I have a Dell XPS that's a couple of years old now, but specced out very, very nicely.

    The MacBook Pro however is the machine I do my writing on and most of my pleasure-computing. To say it is a finely crafted tool would be accurate. Everything about it is geared to be pleasing to the eye and hand. The monitor is more gorgeous on the laptop than my other comp, and it's got a lovely screen as it is. The Mac display shows no pixelation or lack of ability to keep up with the data rate when playing any DVD, and the colors are sublime, not harsh. The sound is superior than any other laptop I have owned. No tinny little speakers in this machine. Watching a movie is on it is enjoyable. Granted I have a 17" monitor, because I don't want to squint at any small screen anymore.
    I repair pc's for a living, so yea, I've come in contact a bit with Macs (I'm new at it, but I now own my own company, and my S.O. has been doing it for 20 years). I don't really need to hate Apple, and don't. I just tell it like it is. That's reality. These things are made of plastic, cheap parts, just like most other pc's/laptops, save a few. They're just gimped a bit more than most other brands, and more expensive.

    "Finely crafted" has to be the funniest fucking thing I've ever heard. I consider a custom-built pc to be finely-crafted. Well-engineered? IBM, Lenovo. Arguably the best you can buy when it comes to heavy-duty, built-to-last, well-constructed parts. Companies gimp the parts put in laptops. They figure out ways to cut corners by trimming-down and cheapening the parts, thereby maximizing profits.

    Concerning the arguments with the screen display, well, I think watching a movie on a 14" display vs. a 13" is superior. When I have a certain amount of money to spend, I want the best bang for the buck, and I can get more by putting my money elsewhere. I can get a more powerful computer, with the same onboard graphics specs, that will play movies and anything else I want to do, same as, for less. Your argument there holds no water. As far as the speakers, MacBook Pros claim to have "stereo speakers with subwoofers". Apple doesn't even bother to tell you what kind. Lenovo provides "premium JBL stereo speakers". Lenovo also provides "One Key Theater", where you can switch from "normal to movie" mode for enhanced video and audio playback, and Dolby Home Theater, and MORE (for less money, of course). http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/c...FABC3CE1BC569A

    I think the pleasure you speak of, is all in your head. There is no evidence of the graphics or sound being better on a Mac. Lenovo actually describes the technologies they are using, and they are superior. Macs are gimped in every sense of the word, if you want to compare part-to-part, piece-to-piece, for the same amount of money. I don't see how you could think a Mac can compete with IBM.

    I bet it's nice with your Mac in lala land.
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  3. #13
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    I repair pc's for a living, so yea, I've come in contact a bit with Macs (I'm new at it, but I now own my own company, and my S.O. has been doing it for 20 years). I don't really need to hate Apple, and don't. I just tell it like it is. That's reality. These things are made of plastic, cheap parts, just like most other pc's/laptops, save a few. They're just gimped a bit more than most other brands, and more expensive.

    "Finely crafted" has to be the funniest fucking thing I've ever heard. I consider a custom-built pc to be finely-crafted. Well-engineered? IBM, Lenovo. Arguably the best you can buy when it comes to heavy-duty, built-to-last, well-constructed parts. Companies gimp the parts put in laptops. They figure out ways to cut corners by trimming-down and cheapening the parts.

    Concerning the arguments with the screen display, well, I think watching a movie on a 14" display vs. a 13" is superior. When I have a certain amount of money to spend, I want the best bang for the buck, and I can get more by putting my money elsewhere. I can get a more powerful computer, with the same onboard graphics specs, that will play movies and anything else I want to do, same as, for less. Your argument there holds no water. As far as the speakers, MacBook Pros claim to have "stereo speakers with subwoofers". Apple doesn't even bother to tell you what kind. Lenovo provides "premium JBL stereo speakers". Lenovo also provides "One Key Theater", where you can switch from "normal to movie" mode for enhanced video and audio playback, and Dolby Home Theater, and MORE (for less money, of course). http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/c...FABC3CE1BC569A

    I think the pleasure you speak of, is all in your head. There is no evidence of the graphics or sound being better on a Mac. Lenovo actually describes the technologies they are using, and they are superior. Macs are gimped in every sense of the word, if you want to compare part-to-part, piece-to-piece, for the same amount of money. I don't see how you could think a Mac can compete with IBM.

    I bet it's nice with your Mac in lala land.
    This is exactly the response I thought you would have. How totally boring.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  4. #14
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    This is exactly the response I thought you would have. How totally boring.
    I think you and I probably disagree on what "boring" means.
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  5. #15
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    I think you and I probably disagree on what "boring" means.
    Perhaps.

    You shouldn't assume I don't care about value and specs though just because I am not espousing them here.

    My MacBook is very nice, it's made of aluminum btw, not plastic, and I do see it as adding value that my other laptops have not offered to me. Your argument is as subjective as mine, so you haven't really discredited it. Spec for spec, a PC looks better on paper than a Mac. It's why I didn't own a Mac for years. Now that I do, I am not disappointed in the extra investment.

    I have owned Toshiba, Gateway and Sager laptops ... the Sager is being used by my son atm and the Gateway, my daughter. The Toshiba, failed. I have been impressed with the videos I have seen on Lenovo (spillage, impact, fast boot), so if CrystalViolet is looking for a PC laptop, it's a worthwhile brand to investigate. I would.

    But I'll just continue to reside here in lala land ...
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  6. #16
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    Perhaps.

    My MacBook is very nice, it's made of aluminum btw, not plastic, and I do see it as adding value that my other laptops have not offered to me.
    Your argument is as subjective as mine, so you haven't really discredited it. Spec for spec, a PC looks better on paper than a Mac. It's why I didn't own a Mac for years. Now that I do, I am not disappointed in the extra investment.

    I have owned Toshiba, Gateway and Sager laptops ... the Sager is being used by my son atm and the Gateway, my daughter. The Toshiba, failed. I have been impressed with the videos I have seen on Lenovo (spillage, impact, fast boot), so if CrystalViolet is looking for a PC laptop, it's a worthwhile brand to investigate. I would.

    But I'll just continue to reside here in lala land ...
    Yes, I know the new Mac shells are made of aluminum; the old ones were polycarbonate. The new ones are fragile and easy to break, in general. The bodies on the new ones can warp lol.....

    I simply think we value different things in general. I couldn't care less about "style" or paying more to be doing what the cool kids are doing lol...... I just want a speedy, well-engineered, well-made laptop that lasts. Mac does not fit the bill, comparatively. Simple as that.

    As far as phones, I think the iphone works well and can compete.
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  7. #17
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    I simply think we value different things in general. I couldn't care less about "style" or paying more to be doing what the cool kids are doing lol...... I just want a speedy, well-engineered, well-made laptop that lasts. Mac does not fit the bill, comparatively. Simple as that.
    I hear your POV and respect your pen and paper analysis of PC vs Mac. But don't you think you have made inaccurate assumptions here? Nowhere do I say I want to pay more to "be doing what the cool kids are doing". Nowhere do I say don't want a "speedy, well-engineered, well-made laptop that lasts." I owned a Sager, one of the best value fastest gaming laptops on the market. My son is still using it.

    I don't think you know what I value, because aside from saying I was pleasantly surprised at how much I enjoy using a Mac, I haven't said what I look for when I buy a computer or how I choose one.

    You see, I AGREE that a PC specs out better than a Mac on paper. In real life usage though, the Mac offers some benefits that weren't tangible to me either until I owned one. And upon reflection, to me they are worth the extra money. Still, I would buy another PC desktop when I upgrade from my XPS.

    That's what I am saying, simple as that.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  8. #18
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    I hear your POV and respect your pen and paper analysis of PC vs Mac. But don't you think you have made inaccurate assumptions here? Nowhere do I say I want to pay more to "be doing what the cool kids are doing". Nowhere do I say don't want a "speedy, well-engineered, well-made laptop that lasts." I owned a Sager, one of the best value fastest gaming laptops on the market. My son is still using it.

    I don't think you know what I value, because aside from saying I was pleasantly surprised at how much I enjoy using a Mac, I haven't said what I look for when I buy a computer or how I choose one.

    You see, I AGREE that a PC specs out better than a Mac on paper. In real life usage though, the Mac offers some benefits that weren't tangible to me either until I owned one. And upon reflection, to me they are worth the extra money. Still, I would buy another PC desktop when I upgrade from my XPS.

    That's what I am saying, simple as that.
    I don't think I assume that's what you are looking for. That's what it sounds like by the description you gave. When you explained earlier the features you enjoyed, it sounded as if you were enjoying it's aesthetics, and overall experience and feelings it gave you.

    I see very few advantages to owning a Mac, other than "style" and aesthetics.... (I personally do not prefer a Mac's look actually lol, .... just because I am more of a rocker, but I can understand why some people might)..... and the fact that it is easy to use. And if some people prefer the overall experience, I can go for that, although to me, it is completely unreasonable. So yes, I suppose I could assume that's what you are getting from using a Mac, and I refer to this as "lala land" lol.... To me, that's exactly where it is. However, your explanation confirmed that I was right if I had initially assumed so.

    There is no evidence to back up any of your claims.
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  9. #19
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    And if some people prefer the overall experience, I can go for that, although to me, it is completely unreasonable.
    That's your opinion, I respect it - yet I find your intractable POV rather unreasonable too. Let's shake hands and call it even.

    So yes, I suppose I could assume that's what you are getting from using a Mac, and I refer to this as "lala land" lol.... To me, that's exactly where it is. However, your explanation confirmed that I was right if I had initially assumed so.
    The difference between you and me is that I speak from experience, not from your "lala land" of speculation and assumption.

    At any rate, my contributions in this thread were addressed to CrystalViolet and based off of my personal vantage point - not to put PC & Mac "head-to-head" or to convince YOU of why the Mac might be a better choice for her.

    You of course, may buy as many Lenovos as you wish.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  10. #20
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    That's your opinion, I respect it - yet I find your intractable POV rather unreasonable too. Let's shake hands and call it even.

    The difference between you and me is that I speak from experience, not from your "lala land" of speculation and assumption.
    I have experience with laptops, lol, and I've played around with Macs here and there. I know what they have to offer. I generally ignore them though, and I don't repair them. There's more overall money to be made with windows pc's, since then I can cater to businesses, and I can get into custom-builds, and that's more of what I am looking for.

    So, although I have never bought one, and one thing you can bet on is that I probably never will unless I somehow become brain-damaged , I have seen enough from working with the ones that have come into my life here and there, to understand what they have to offer. What is seen on paper can be seen by the naked eye when testing a Mac.
    Last edited by ICUP; 09-01-2011 at 08:48 PM.
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