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  1. #11
    Senior Member Jessica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopelandic View Post
    "common sense" is the antithesis to science. Particularly psychology. There's a rant in there, but I can't be fucked.
    No need, I'll take this one.

    Common sense is the biggest load of bullshit ever. I can't tell you how many times I've heard some dumbfuck redneck say something like "well ya'll may be smarter but I dun have more common sense" like there's something built in that names humans, by default, not retarded.

    If you're willing to admit I'm smarter, how did I miss something that, by virtue of its title, is common?

    Common
    kom-uh n
    adjective, -er, -est, noun

    • pertaining or belonging equally to an entire community, nation, or culture
    • belonging equally to, or shared alike by, two or more or all in question
    If there's a large swath of smarter than average people who are missing this magical common sense, by what measure is it common sense? Furthermore, what the fuck does it even mean?

    If smarter people, the thinking person, the genius has less grasp of common sense than some random redneck who has trouble pronouncing every other word, what are we missing and how do you have it?

    Let's assume for the sake of argumentation that common sense does exist. What is it? So you're going to claim that people with below average intelligence have some common sense that transcends the boundaries of intelligent, what is it and how do you know it's true?

    Granted, common sense could be some philosophically advanced idea that would utterly fuck the minds of every skeptic and genius on the planet, but what are the odds of that? I've never heard it explained what common sense actually is. It's always used as a cop-out when someone can't argue worth a shit or knows they're wrong.

    "If there were tests so people had to vote in elections, a Democrat would never win again."
    "Those who self-identify as Liberal and Democrat have higher IQs and are most often better educated than those declaring themselves Conservative or Republican."
    "Yeah but Conservative Republicans have more common sense."
    "If they're smarter and have more knowledge, that means you couldn't pass the test!"
    "No, there would never be a Democrat in office again because only people with common sense would pass."
    "What is common sense?"
    *a conversation centered around dodging the question repeatedly ensues*

    I have had this happen.

    There is no such thing as 'common sense', nothing is 'obvious', and everything should be questioned thoroughly.
    I have a (new) blog here.

    You should do these: JohariNohari

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slayer View Post
    No need, I'll take this one.

    Common sense is the biggest load of bullshit ever. I can't tell you how many times I've heard some dumbfuck redneck say something like "well ya'll may be smarter but I dun have more common sense" like there's something built in that names humans, by default, not retarded.

    If you're willing to admit I'm smarter, how did I miss something that, by virtue of its title, is common?



    If there's a large swath of smarter than average people who are missing this magical common sense, by what measure is it common sense? Furthermore, what the fuck does it even mean?

    If smarter people, the thinking person, the genius has less grasp of common sense than some random redneck who has trouble pronouncing every other word, what are we missing and how do you have it?

    Let's assume for the sake of argumentation that common sense does exist. What is it? So you're going to claim that people with below average intelligence have some common sense that transcends the boundaries of intelligent, what is it and how do you know it's true?

    Granted, common sense could be some philosophically advanced idea that would utterly fuck the minds of every skeptic and genius on the planet, but what are the odds of that? I've never heard it explained what common sense actually is. It's always used as a cop-out when someone can't argue worth a shit or knows they're wrong.

    "If there were tests so people had to vote in elections, a Democrat would never win again."
    "Those who self-identify as Liberal and Democrat have higher IQs and are most often better educated than those declaring themselves Conservative or Republican."
    "Yeah but Conservative Republicans have more common sense."
    "If they're smarter and have more knowledge, that means you couldn't pass the test!"
    "No, there would never be a Democrat in office again because only people with common sense would pass."
    "What is common sense?"
    *a conversation centered around dodging the question repeatedly ensues*

    I have had this happen.

    There is no such thing as 'common sense', nothing is 'obvious', and everything should be questioned thoroughly.
    I think common sense can be compared to street-smarts, observation skills, and experiential knowledge. You make it sound as though only scientists know about life, but the truth is that while some common sense is bullcrap because it's nothing more than repetition of what other people have told them, other forms of common sense get people through life quite splendidly, meanwhile INTx in their lab wonder what it is about other people they simply just don't get. I don't think that people with below average intelligence have more common sense, but I do believe that people with more tactical intelligence or people skills may have more common sense than someone who has a different form of intelligence.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slayer View Post
    I've never heard it explained what common sense actually is.
    The Scottish School of Common Sense might help you out there. Its founder Thomas Reid made this simple definition:

    "If there are certain principles, as I think there are, which the constitution of our nature leads us to believe, and which we are under a necessity to take for granted in the common concerns of life, without being able to give a reason for them--these are what we call the principles of common sense; and what is manifestly contrary to them, is what we call absurd."(source)

    For the most part, it seems common sense tends to depend upon a Realist framework of one form or another.

  4. #14
    Sniffles
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    Here's a more Thomistic explaination, which still seems to parallel those of Reid:
    Ordinary knowledge consists for the most part of mere opinions or beliefs, more or less well founded. But it implies a solid kernal of geniune certainties in which the philosopher recognises in the first place data of the senses (for example: that bodies possess length, breadth, and height), secondly self-evident axioms (for example, the whole is greater than the part, every event has a cause, etc.), and thirdly, consequences immediately deducible from these axioms (proximate conclusions). These certainties which arise spontaneously in the mind when we first come to the use of reason are thus the work of nature in us, and may therefore be called an endowment of nature as proceeding from the natural perception, consent, instinct, or natural sense of the intellect. Since their source is human nature itself, they are common to all men. They may therefore be said to belong to the common perception, consent, or instinct, or to the common sense of mankind. The great truths without which man's moral life is impossible - for example knowledge of God's existence, the freedom of the will, etc. - belong to this domain of common sense, as consequences immediately deducible (proximate conclusions) from primary data apprehended by the intellect. All men, unless spoiled by a faulty education or by some intellectual vice, possess a natural certainty of these truths.
    'An introduction to philosophy' pp.134-35

  5. #15
    The Eighth Colour Octarine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    I think common sense can be compared to street-smarts, observation skills, and experiential knowledge.
    According to Wikipedia, common sense is... (joking)

    Our knowledge and wisdom always occurs with respect to our experience. My impression is that common sense refers to the judgements we make based on our everyday experience. The concept of common sense assumes these experiences are common. However, due to the complexity of our world, different people can have quite different experiences under similar circumstances. So in a broader sense common sense might not actually be so constant across a heterogeneous group.

    Now, when someone tries to insult another by stating they lack common sense, they are either implying that they lack common experiences, or that they lack the ability to learn from common experiences. But scientific knowledge and common sense don't have to be mutually exclusive.

    The scientific domain of experience is very different, since it relies on rigorous controlled tests and large sample sizes and a consistent body of literature. Unfortunately, it is often difficult or even undesirable to apply these principles to the the issues we face in our day to day lives.

    Anyway, as you point out, it is the domain of "street-smarts, observation skills, and experiential knowledge" that is necessary for daily life.
    I think the danger is when this presumption of common sense is applied to domains more suited to in depth analysis and this includes large-scale politics.

    I always liked this cartoon in illustrating the difference in the two domains:


  6. #16
    Senior Member Jessica's Avatar
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    I'd make a minor correction: "I wonder if that happens every time... hey common sense, come over here and try this shit."
    I have a (new) blog here.

    You should do these: JohariNohari

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    'An introduction to philosophy' pp.134-35
    Sorry forgot to mention the author of Jacques Maritain.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catbert View Post
    According to Wikipedia, common sense is... (joking)

    Our knowledge and wisdom always occurs with respect to our experience. My impression is that common sense refers to the judgements we make based on our everyday experience. The concept of common sense assumes these experiences are common. However, due to the complexity of our world, different people can have quite different experiences under similar circumstances. So in a broader sense common sense might not actually be so constant across a heterogeneous group.

    Now, when someone tries to insult another by stating they lack common sense, they are either implying that they lack common experiences, or that they lack the ability to learn from common experiences. But scientific knowledge and common sense don't have to be mutually exclusive.

    The scientific domain of experience is very different, since it relies on rigorous controlled tests and large sample sizes and a consistent body of literature. Unfortunately, it is often difficult or even undesirable to apply these principles to the the issues we face in our day to day lives.

    Anyway, as you point out, it is the domain of "street-smarts, observation skills, and experiential knowledge" that is necessary for daily life.
    I think the danger is when this presumption of common sense is applied to domains more suited to in depth analysis and this includes large-scale politics.

    I always liked this cartoon in illustrating the difference in the two domains:

    lol the cartoon is a great example... the "normal person" would have the common sense to not hurt themselves again

  9. #19
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    OMG you guys. Destroying a thread like that is totally not cool.....neither are all the personal attacks.

    Moved 53 posts to OT land. Don't do that again, please.

    (I left the first "common sense" posts since they seem to be somewhat related to the OP....if you continue discussing those, please be polite about it, and stick to the topic. thanks)
    -end of thread-

  10. #20
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Dark matter and dark energy are not obvious.

    Science tells us that 30% of the universe is dark matter and 70% of the universe is dark energy, and the part we can see and understand makes up only !% of the universe.

    So science tells us we don't understand almost all of the universe. This is counter-intuitive and non-obvious.

    But why should we be surprised as almost all of science is counter-intuitive, just as literacy itself is counter-intuitive.

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