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  1. #21
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediVulcanisim View Post
    Not Exactly, but very similar in concept. There would be no exchange of goods or services; just the expectation that immediate human needs are tended to first and foremost.

    For example: Say community A has a shortage of water and community B does not have enough to cover all of the water needed, but is able to give a portion of what they have without endangering their lives. The water is a gift, not something you can hold over another human being and essentially force community A to give more than what they are able to just to survive a tad longer. If anything, a profit based economy is a band-aid for human existence.
    Sounds like Fresco's theory.

  2. #22
    Member JediVulcanisim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Can you link the sources for your understanding of this term? It was originally coined by Jacque Fresco who's the founder of The Venus Project, where the Zeitgeist Movement is the official activist arm.

    It's a form of global collectivism in every aspect of society. It would include overhauling the existing monetary system, where everyone lives equally regardless of their work or productivity and technology would be used to assist and also to decision make.
    I understand the term's origin. I have taken Fresco's concept and applied a set of mental processes in order to set the stage for a realization of his vision. Realistically my vision is more of a transitory stage to Fresco's vision. An overhaul would be nice, but to gradually influence human behavior based on their actual needs and justifying thought processes because of wants.
    Jedi Code (revised by Moi)

    With emotion one must search for peace.
    With the understanding of ignorance one must search for knowledge.
    In passion one must seek serenity.
    In chaos, one must search for harmony.
    In death one may become one with The Force.

  3. #23
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediVulcanisim View Post
    I understand the term's origin. I have taken Fresco's concept and applied a set of mental processes in order to set the stage for a realization of his vision. Realistically my vision is more of a transitory stage to Fresco's vision. An overhaul would be nice, but to gradually influence human behavior based on their actual needs and justifying thought processes because of wants.
    Then I'm going to give it you straight. Why would people work harder than the person next to them, if there's no return? Take a hard look at the collectivism theories incorporated in "The Great Leap Forward". It failed because people stopped wanting to excel since there was no return.

  4. #24
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    Default Collectivism vs Capitalism

    There is no difference between the two in goal. The aim of both is to maximise the net available production. The only question is: which works best?

  5. #25
    Senor Membrane
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediVulcanisim View Post

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gKX9TWRyfs

    I request you watch these in full first.
    Whew! That's brilliant! I've seen the original some years ago, but this one is amazing. It just put's it all so nicely together, and provides a clear picture of a possible way to overcome the problem. The only problem I see with this (as the original) is that it can be seen too easily as a conspiration theory. It doesn't make it clear enough that there is no one ruling this (in the traditional sense) but it has "just happened" as the system has evolved. Quite ironically, the next step is made possible precisely because of the current system. If the system wasn't there just as it is now, there would be no internet and there would be no global change of attitude. If the system wasn't going to hit the wall soon, there would be no realization of the fundamental flaw. The only thing that worries me is if it will be too late to get the critical mass before it collapses.

  6. #26
    Member JediVulcanisim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Then I'm going to give it you straight. Why would people work harder than the person next to them, if there's no return? Take a hard look at the collectivism theories incorporated in "The Great Leap Forward". It failed because people stopped wanting to excel since there was no return.
    The return in one receives is that of survival and living as one sees fit. No imposition of either party is available.

    Besides, return of what? What return does one expect? More profit? Profit is irrelevant in the resource based economy.
    Jedi Code (revised by Moi)

    With emotion one must search for peace.
    With the understanding of ignorance one must search for knowledge.
    In passion one must seek serenity.
    In chaos, one must search for harmony.
    In death one may become one with The Force.

  7. #27
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediVulcanisim View Post
    Profit is irrelevant in the resource based economy.
    But profit will be never irrelevant to mankind
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  8. #28
    Member JediVulcanisim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    But profit will be never irrelevant to mankind
    By profit, what do you mean?
    Jedi Code (revised by Moi)

    With emotion one must search for peace.
    With the understanding of ignorance one must search for knowledge.
    In passion one must seek serenity.
    In chaos, one must search for harmony.
    In death one may become one with The Force.

  9. #29
    Senor Membrane
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    You know, I just did something I've never done before. I became an activist. I found out about this movement, went to a local meeting, and it was obvious that this is really what I should be doing. I've never even considered activism because all these other organizations, they have no plan, not really. They just make noise about what is wrong in the world, and while I agree with them, they don't have a vision so they won't get it done. Zeitgeist does, and I am pretty sure that one way or another we will have to take it to survive.


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