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  1. #11
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    To grind this down to the simplest terms, I'm quite happy not knowing the right way to scrub an article of clothing, using sand and beating methods. I'm also happy to be able to do five loads of laundry in one day with almost no effort.

    We've become an exception processing, conceptual problem solving society, allowing technology to handle more mundane tasks. In becoming so, it's freed our minds to focus on improvements, rather than focus on casting spears into large animals. But one day, I WILL attend a pit BBQ where I can walk up to a cow being roasted on a spit and slice a dripping sliver with my swiss army knife, to consume. No one will ever take the primitive out of me!

  2. #12
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    BBC News - How good software makes us stupid

    Reading this, and agreeing with the premise, could we be fooling ourselves?
    Of course it makes people stupid. It's effectively out-sourcing cognitive processing. That's why when you 'phone a call centre you end up talking to retards who only know how to read a script and insist that "the system" is infallible and who express zero ability to think for themselves. I've noticed call centre operators are getting dumber and dumber every year.

    I don't really care. As one of the people it gets out-sourced to, s'all good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffywolf View Post
    If the amount of what we can perceive at any given time is limited, than allowing software to perceive rudementary information for us, it will leave us with the capacity to perceive beyond the rudementary.
    That's not what happens though. Most people won't use their brains any more than they have to.

    EDIT. Oh, and good to see you back, Xander.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  3. #13
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    According to the business books I've been reading lately an industry (including education) puts standards into place once they see performance has become "good enough". Standars usually aren't put into place when most people want improvements.

    In the case of education grading and other standards were put into place when education really was "good enough". However society has evolved a lot since those standards were put into place. Education is not good enough anymore. Not only is there room for improvement, but there is a lot of desire for improvement. However there isn't much profit incentive for improvement.
    Using the accumulation of these paragraphs you've managed to show one way in which there can be a desire for improvement but little or no movement in a business. If it's not profitable then it's work for little or no reward.

    As for standards, it's education people setting the standards and the curriculum. It's every other sucker who has to make do with the resulting student.
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    Overall I think there will be some type of improvements in education, but they won't come from within the normal official channels. At some point some type of educators from the unofficial channels will find a way to make money because they are doing a much better job at teaching people what they need to know. Then the official system will either take note and change or lose all of its students.
    It's called private education surely? Oh and it's still not popular en masse because it's a whole lot more expensive than free and to keep the prices up it's also exclusive.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  4. #14
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphor View Post
    To grind this down to the simplest terms, I'm quite happy not knowing the right way to scrub an article of clothing, using sand and beating methods. I'm also happy to be able to do five loads of laundry in one day with almost no effort.

    We've become an exception processing, conceptual problem solving society, allowing technology to handle more mundane tasks. In becoming so, it's freed our minds to focus on improvements, rather than focus on casting spears into large animals. But one day, I WILL attend a pit BBQ where I can walk up to a cow being roasted on a spit and slice a dripping sliver with my swiss army knife, to consume. No one will ever take the primitive out of me!
    2 things.

    As someone who listens to engineers whinge a lot, do you have an appreciation for the washing machine? Do you understand it or just use it?

    The other thing is, did you just go from doing laundry to slicing up half cooked bovine? You might want to check those mushrooms before making soup!

    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  5. #15
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    Of course it makes people stupid. It's effectively out-sourcing cognitive processing. That's why when you 'phone a call centre you end up talking to retards who only know how to read a script and insist that "the system" is infallible and who express zero ability to think for themselves. I've noticed call centre operators are getting dumber and dumber every year.

    I don't really care. As one of the people it gets out-sourced to, s'all good.
    Interesting. Wouldn't you therefore end up with two groups then? The users, who'd be vegetables, and the designers, brain in a jar?
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  6. #16
    Nips away your dignity Fluffywolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    That's not what happens though. Most people won't use their brains any more than they have to.
    Luckily, I am not most people. So I will indulge myself in good software in order to use the capacity of my brain for other things. :>
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  7. #17
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffywolf View Post
    Luckily, I am not most people. So I will indulge myself in good software in order to use the capacity of my brain for other things. :>
    You said it's making "us" more intelligent. But if you are "not like most people" in your use of it, you can't make that argument.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  8. #18
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Interesting. Wouldn't you therefore end up with two groups then? The users, who'd be vegetables, and the designers, brain in a jar?
    Whadya mean "end up"? We're there already!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  9. #19
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    Whadya mean "end up"? We're there already!
    Well I guess.

    The concerning thing is though as an outside observer the brains in a jar are capable of equal stupidity as everyone else and we're not just talking off days. Off days are like Dyson deciding to actually produce his £200 gentle breeze fan where as some go from cock up to cock up... the "geniuses" in governance come to mind...
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  10. #20
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Well I guess.

    The concerning thing is though as an outside observer the brains in a jar are capable of equal stupidity as everyone else and we're not just talking off days. Off days are like Dyson deciding to actually produce his £200 gentle breeze fan where as some go from cock up to cock up... the "geniuses" in governance come to mind...
    Totally agree. Plus making ourselves so dependent on technology makes us vulnerable - to terrorism or other hostile agencies. I'm more worried about this defencelessness than about the dumbing down of society at large.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

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