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  1. #21
    shoshaku jushaku rivercrow's Avatar
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    From what I was reading, the Body Works/Nazi guy invented the process and The Body/Chinese Prisoners guy was his protege who split off to do his own thing.

    LOL. This whole convo is getting crasser by the moment.

    What I meant to comment before was that all exhibitions of human remains have an ethical component. Even if we don't know the person, shouldn't we respect the dead? If the person is anonymous, does that raise the stakes on how we should treat the body?

    Displays of humans as objects.... It's dehumanizing by default.
    Who rises in the morning, looks in the mirror and says, "I think I will do something stupid today?" -- James Hollis
    If people never did silly things nothing intelligent would ever get done. -- Ludwig Wittgenstein
    Whaling is illegal in Oklahoma.

  2. #22
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Yeah, I think that NPR piece referenced their working together. I had originally heard that the Body Works guy took only volunteers (people who willed their bodies to him specifically) which I have no ethical issue with whatsoever. I'm a little more squeamish about the whole "unclaimed bodies" part of the equation, even if they weren't Chinese dissidents. Not squeamish enough to stay away, I guess.

  3. #23
    shoshaku jushaku rivercrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Yeah, I think that NPR piece referenced their working together. I had originally heard that the Body Works guy took only volunteers (people who willed their bodies to him specifically) which I have no ethical issue with whatsoever. I'm a little more squeamish about the whole "unclaimed bodies" part of the equation, even if they weren't Chinese dissidents. Not squeamish enough to stay away, I guess.
    Yeah, that nails it. The Nazi show it is.

    There's a brat stand down the street we can hit for lunch, too.
    Who rises in the morning, looks in the mirror and says, "I think I will do something stupid today?" -- James Hollis
    If people never did silly things nothing intelligent would ever get done. -- Ludwig Wittgenstein
    Whaling is illegal in Oklahoma.

  4. #24
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rivercrow View Post
    Yeah, that nails it. The Nazi show it is.

    There's a brat stand down the street we can hit for lunch, too.
    I believe the original guy used unclaimed bodies as well, but he promises he got them ethically from universities. Still, questionable ethics are better than almost certainly bad ones.

  5. #25
    only bites when provoked
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    The Body Works guy has a disclaimer on his website about how he would never get bodies from Chinese prisons. I think there's a rivalry between him and the Bodies: The Exhibition guy. How bizarre, how bizarre.
    Reminds me of this one CEO I know...

  6. #26
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    I find it strange that those with no claimed religious morality find this wrong in a distinctly religious way, while they should not care.

    Why do you need to respect dead bodies? That's a totally archaic mentality.

  7. #27
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf View Post
    I find it strange that those with no claimed religious morality find this wrong in a distinctly religious way, while they should not care.

    Why do you need to respect dead bodies? That's a totally archaic mentality.
    You know, I'm going to agree with you. They're dead, they don't care. Funerals are for the living, not the dead.

    My mother tells us to bury her in a pine box and send her flowers while she's alive. It makes so much more sense.

  8. #28
    shoshaku jushaku rivercrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf View Post
    I find it strange that those with no claimed religious morality find this wrong in a distinctly religious way, while they should not care.

    Why do you need to respect dead bodies? That's a totally archaic mentality.
    You mean me, personally? Or do you mean "you" in the generic sense?
    Who rises in the morning, looks in the mirror and says, "I think I will do something stupid today?" -- James Hollis
    If people never did silly things nothing intelligent would ever get done. -- Ludwig Wittgenstein
    Whaling is illegal in Oklahoma.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by rivercrow View Post
    You mean me, personally? Or do you mean "you" in the generic sense?
    Generic. See post.

  10. #30
    shoshaku jushaku rivercrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf View Post
    Generic. See post.
    See post. See post stand. Stand, post, stand.

    I'll take a stab.
    • We respect our dead in recognition of our mortality.
    • We respect our dead to show how we ourselves would prefer to be treated.
    • Respecting the dead deobjectifies them. Objectifying humans is a slippery slope--do we objectify only the dead ones, or extend that to the living as well? Only some of the living? Sure, it's a matter of degree.
    • Objectifying living creatures in general carries some risk. Objectify only the lower life forms? How far up can we objectify? Some argue that objectification of any living being forces us to be desensitized to our own objectification.


    etc....

    Who rises in the morning, looks in the mirror and says, "I think I will do something stupid today?" -- James Hollis
    If people never did silly things nothing intelligent would ever get done. -- Ludwig Wittgenstein
    Whaling is illegal in Oklahoma.

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