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Thread: Absolute Zero

  1. #61
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    A lot more than motion is relative. Energy is also relative, so what's special about this particular zero energy, when you can simply define anything so it has zero energy (same as zero motion)?

    Again, there's energy-less motion, field fluctuations and many other complexities on top of this.

  2. #62
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    I'm not sure if it is so simple erm. I believe absolute zero represents a theoretical absolute, not a relative temperature; hence the use of the term absolute.
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    So I ask again, what makes it special, meaning what makes it absolute?

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    I don't know the specifics, but I believe it relates to the ceasing of all molecular motion. If your concerned with relativity here, then it would be the ceasing of all molecular motion relative to itself.
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    The closer particles reach absolute zero, the more remarkable properties they show. Supercondictivity and superfluidity, the possibilities for potential practical use for this is endless.

    100% effecient electrical systems for example, you could even theoretically create electric loops and electric engines that need to be started and can run off of its starting power infinitely!

    Ofcourse, that would only be possible if we can create the perfect container in which we can allow the superconductive material to do it's work, which is pretty much impossible, probably.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnyboy View Post
    I don't know the specifics, but I believe it relates to the ceasing of all molecular motion. If your concerned with relativity here, then it would be the ceasing of all molecular motion relative to itself.
    That's not a privileged frame of reference. All things have zero motion relative to themselves. It's as simple as using a frame of reference which remains completely parallel with the object being measured (so there are countless other reference frames that give an object zero motion, not just the one in the same space and time as the object).

    Zero temperature relative to a particular frame of reference seems trivial if it simply means zero motion or energy, as every molecule has zero motion and energy relative to countless frames of reference during every moment.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by erm View Post
    That's not a privileged frame of reference. All things have zero motion relative to themselves. It's as simple as using a frame of reference which remains completely parallel with the object being measured (so there are countless other reference frames that give an object zero motion, not just the one in the same space and time as the object).

    Zero temperature relative to a particular frame of reference seems trivial if it simply means zero motion or energy, as every molecule has zero motion and energy relative to countless frames of reference every moment.
    I knew the ambiguity would get me into trouble. Thank you for assuming me stupid rather than inept at communication. Molecules are made up of constituent matter. The temperature of a molecule is due to the motion of those constituent pieces of matter relative to each other. Absolute zero, then, would be achieved by a molecule whose constituent matter was not in motion (at least relative to other constituents).
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    Quote Originally Posted by erm View Post
    That's not a privileged frame of reference. All things have zero motion relative to themselves. It's as simple as using a frame of reference which remains completely parallel with the object being measured (so there are countless other reference frames that give an object zero motion, not just the one in the same space and time as the object).

    Zero temperature relative to a particular frame of reference seems trivial if it simply means zero motion or energy, as every molecule has zero motion and energy relative to countless frames of reference during every moment.
    Absolute zero in terms of relativity means zero motion relative to the fixed space of the container it is put in. Absolute zero can not be reached outside of a container. And since it is contained, it does not submit to the chaos of standard physical laws.

    Absolute zero attempts to bridge the gap of chaos and order. To bring order to chaos and to bring chaos to order.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnyboy View Post
    Molecules are made up of constituent matter. The temperature of a molecule is due to the motion of those constituent pieces of matter relative to each other. Absolute zero, then would be a molecule whose constituent matter was not in motion.
    And all I have said, again, applies to those constituent pieces of matter, just as it is to molecules relative to each other and beyond. What's absolute about any of that? What's absolute about multiple objects moving in parallel?

    You can keep shrinking the matter, or even energy, being referred to, but the question remains the same.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffywolf View Post
    Absolute zero in terms of relativity means zero motion relative to the fixed space of the container it is put in. Absolute zero can not be reached outside of a container. And since it is contained, it does not submit to the chaos of standard physical laws.

    Absolute zero attempts to bridge the gap of chaos and order. To bring order to chaos and to bring chaos to order.
    What's special about this container, that it subverts the laws of nature? If such a state is achieved, where the container and what's inside have parallel motion, how is that different from two particles having parallel motion but being at seperate sides of the visible universe?

  10. #70
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    It seems to me that there might be a distinction between kinetic energy and thermal energy, even though both involve motion. Let us assume that there exists a universe which is composed of only two molecules, and these molecules orbit around each other (a.k.a. they are not motionless relative to one another). The temperature of said molecules can still theoretically be absolute zero if there is no motion going on within the molecules.

    Edit: I have taken all of one semester of calculus based physics, so my understanding of this stuff is pretty shameful. This is purely conjecture.
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