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  1. #11
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    I do think there aren't many INFP villains in fiction mainly because they usually make for shitty villains. When we go into unhealthy, negative modes we tend to get mopey, disillusioned and closed off from others, rather than try to take over the world. Villains are almost always active by nature. Passive villains don't often work. Basically you're going to need something extra to make a INFP character into a worthwhile villain.
    Totally agreed on this. In fact, villains are required to be more active than the heroes; a common motif is for the hero to be doing their thing in life, then the villain upsets the apple cart / tries to fulfill his master plan, and this is the impetus to stir the hero to action / REACTING to the aggressions of the villain.

    INxPs are very passive by nature, as Informatives and philosophical types; we are far more likely speculate on the nature of existence (its inherent functional or moral nature) as a detached observer. And then when we are not functioning properly, we withdraw further. The battleground as others have said is often internal -- a war of ideas or a war of morals that we test within ourselves.

    Note that Andrew from "Chronicle" is motivated by a long period of injustice in his life, resulting in a lot of internalized rage/bittnerness, and so when he finally has power, he lashes out. It's something that happened to him and stirred him into an internal frenzy, he's reacting. I think INFP is a plausible read; if he had grown up in an environment that didn't foster rage, he likely wouldn't be destructive and "right the wrongs" in the sadistic way he does. He's kind of an anti-hero in the movie -- abused child becoming the abuser rather than the hero he might have been. He also becomes an embodiment of the "truth" he has been learning in his life (about being an apex predator); my experience as an INP is that I make myself my own "experiment" per se to learn/express truth, and here Andrew is reflecting back his own life experience that he has been letting percolate inside.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft
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  2. #12
    Senior Member blahblahbob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Note that Andrew from "Chronicle" is motivated by a long period of injustice in his life, resulting in a lot of internalized rage/bittnerness, and so when he finally has power, he lashes out. It's something that happened to him and stirred him into an internal frenzy, he's reacting. I think INFP is a plausible read; if he had grown up in an environment that didn't foster rage, he likely wouldn't be destructive and "right the wrongs" in the sadistic way he does. He's kind of an anti-hero in the movie -- abused child becoming the abuser rather than the hero he might have been. He also becomes an embodiment of the "truth" he has been learning in his life (about being an apex predator); my experience as an INP is that I make myself my own "experiment" per se to learn/express truth, and here Andrew is reflecting back his own life experience that he has been letting percolate inside.
    I do agree with the idea that INFP villains have to be pretty explosive rather than methodical (for the most part). Like when Anekin Skywalkers's mother gets killed, he slaughters an entire camp of raiders in cold blood. It's not something he thought out, not something he thinks is rational. It's just him being very angry and acting on it.

  3. #13
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    Yeah, IXXPs and especially INXPs aren't very common villains, since they are often rather passive by nature (especially when unhealthy). It's difficult to pull of a truly villainous INFP. The only character I can think of who might qualify is N from the Pokemon Black and White. I never considered him a villain though, even if he's technically on the antagonist's side. Also I'm not entirely sure sure if he's INFP, he could be INFJ.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by blahblahbob View Post
    I think it's a mistake to believe that all INFPs see themselves as virtuous. Fi isn't always an "I feel virtuous" function. Sometimes it's just "I do what my emotions tell me to do." There's nothing about any of the MBTI types that implies virtue or lack thereof. I think Jung would have been very uncomfortable attaching value judgements and morals to his temperments.
    We are talking about INFP villains; not INFPs in general - I have never suggested that all INFPs consider themselves virtuous.

  5. #15
    Senior Member blahblahbob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    We are talking about INFP villains; not INFPs in general - I have never suggested that all INFPs consider themselves virtuous.
    You're starting with the incorrect assumption that Fi Ne is always a virtuous/empathetic pairing. It frequently is, but, for example, Sweeney Todd is a great example of it going wrong:


  6. #16
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Totally agreed on this. In fact, villains are required to be more active than the heroes; a common motif is for the hero to be doing their thing in life, then the villain upsets the apple cart / tries to fulfill his master plan, and this is the impetus to stir the hero to action / REACTING to the aggressions of the villain.
    Exactly. I took a screenwriting class at uni and my lecturer said that if you were having problems with a lack of conflict (particularly in the second act), try thinking from the point of view of the villain. Focus on what he/she would do to lay out obstacles for the protagonist and then you've got something for the protagonist to react off.

    INxPs are very passive by nature, as Informatives and philosophical types; we are far more likely speculate on the nature of existence (its inherent functional or moral nature) as a detached observer. And then when we are not functioning properly, we withdraw further. The battleground as others have said is often internal -- a war of ideas or a war of morals that we test within ourselves.
    Yeah, now that you mention it IxxPs in general are too passive for evil plotting. I have a giant list of fiction character typings that I made for myself and there are next to no IxxP villains on it. A few anti-heroes, and some morally dubious and unlikeable people, but not much in the way of proper bad guys.
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    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  7. #17
    Senior Member blahblahbob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    Yeah, now that you mention it IxxPs in general are too passive for evil plotting. I have a giant list of fiction character typings that I made for myself and there are next to no IxxP villains on it. A few anti-heroes, and some morally dubious and unlikeable people, but not much in the way of proper bad guys.
    Ok, well, I was using the term "villain" in the sense of "particularly evil character" - not in the literary sense of "antagonist."

    Who are your anti-heroes for your INFP list?

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    Pretty much INFPs are equals to everyone else in how they can be villainous. The difference is in why.

    1. Moral reasons - John Brown, Charles J. Guitea, I was almost going to say Lee Harvey Oswald, but that face is neutral. Way too neutral. Hrrm. Maybe he was the illusive psychopath INFP. Oh well. Klebold, he was VERY political. He was quite dissatisfied with society. Felt that it should change (a little help from the psychopath didn't hurt to push him over the edge). Changed it.

    2. Societal reasons - Dylan Klebold - He was Jewish. This might not have hurt, but it certainly did not help. Pretty sure it wouldn't help in wasp america at least.

    3. Maltreatment - Klebold, tormented at school, pelted with ketchup, and other weird and unusual punishments that only happen in a high-school.

    4. Upbringing - John Brown? He could have been raised a radical. Putting Klebold here because he was following a psychopath. Pretty sure this was a psychopath who was caught in the act of psychopathy, and thus branded with the label of weird. The abuse from it was quite horrible. As such, this gave him the perception that he could not achieve his goals, and so the time came for him to flip out. His soldier was Klebold, who he indoctrinated into his army. Indoctrination and upbringing are the same.

    Honestly, I'm quite unsure as to Harris either. Could have been an INFP psychopath. Meh, probably not. Oh well, I'll let this one unresearched thread of thought go. I'm going to bed. Someone else do the research. Probably INTJ.

    Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  9. #19
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Not much in the anti-hero category unless you count Llewyn Davis from Inside Llewyn Davis.
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    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  10. #20
    The Typing Tabby grey_beard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by riva View Post
    @OrangeAppled will be a scary villain in an infj point of view movie.

    However, most of the drama will be internal. No blood will be shed. Just words unspoken.

    The silent treatment will be her power.

    The bad apple will be the title of the movie.

    May I suggest...a silent movie?
    "Love never needs time. But friendship always needs time. More and more and more time, up to long past midnight." -- The Crime of Captain Gahagan

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