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Thread: The Dark Knight

  1. #81
    Welcome to Sunnyside Mondo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    I didn't see anything particularly intuitish about her.

    Everyone always assumes that the title elevated emoter must be NF.


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    Yea, the more I think about it, the more sense ESFJ makes than ENFJ.

    Whether the Joker is a 'sociopath' or not- it is clear that he is a danger to others. I wouldn't care about his aptitude for empathy- if he is capable of much empathy but is destroying Gotham- I wouldn't give him a pass!
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  2. #82
    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
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    i think the whole what is batman debate comes down to:

    his activities and technical stuff, his adeptness at burglary make me think ISTP.
    his inability to kill the joker out of principle, his moment where the joker "wins" at getting batman to hit him in the interrogation makes me think Fi.

    ISTPs have had an archetype of the psycho-vigilante as i saw somewhere before...but ultimatly batman is more than a vigilante...he is more of a martyr who has yet to die (refering to the dark night)....that again says Fi.

    INTJ could satisfy the technical mastery AND the Fi...but do we think batman could be such slave to a TERTIARY Fi????? Im doubtful.

    I think INFP who has been driven to the edge (push them too far and they snap) is more likely...the snapping event was when the best man in gotham, his father was killed...i think thatd be enough to push an INFP to some inferior functions to act out on his rage/vengence on crime.

  3. #83
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    I think people just have a hard time believing an INFP can handle technology past basic uses. Funny thing is, I'm a computer technician, I'm into snowboarding, and I'm not bad with a sword... Either an INFP is capable of this stuff or I'm not INFP...
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  4. #84
    Welcome to Sunnyside Mondo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    I think people just have a hard time believing an INFP can handle technology past basic uses. Funny thing is, I'm a computer technician, I'm into snowboarding, and I'm not bad with a sword... Either an INFP is capable of this stuff or I'm not INFP...
    That's not the reason why I think Batman's INTJ.
    He's incredibly independent in the Ni sense.
    I agree that he has Fi but I think it's a tertiary function.
    I don't think the INFP would be as comfortable doing what he had to do in the end as an INTJ would be.
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  5. #85
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    I think people just have a hard time believing an INFP can handle technology past basic uses. Funny thing is, I'm a computer technician, I'm into snowboarding, and I'm not bad with a sword... Either an INFP is capable of this stuff or I'm not INFP...
    Well, I never ruled out that he was Feeler, but still felt more like he was an INFJ. It might partly be because I'm sure he's a One, and Ones tend to be INFJs much more often than INFPs. *shrug*

    The bigger point is that the MBTI might be too simple. This may be yet another situation where going straight to the functions would yield more accurate conjecture.
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  6. #86
    Senior Member Snowey1210's Avatar
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    The Joker is too tough to type as he is obviously psychotic. However from what is suggested in the film he does play out as an ENTP, admittedly an extremely anarchist one without any boundaries.

    He doesn't appear to have the level of planning possessed by a J, and any sort of crime he commits still has that smash-and-grab mentality that doesn't seem as conducive with J reasoning. He demonstrates the ability to think ahead (Jail scene for example) however I see this as more of a function of his Ne, rather than a judging capacity.

    Batman is a tough one, but I bring it back to that classic MBTI question regarding "Justice over Mercy". Whilst Batman does spare criminals lives, his whole mentality is to do with bringing justice to the city (notably in a manner very by the book). So in this case I'd argue that he was a T. Think also of the two bombs that were going off at once and who he decides to save. To me this is more of a decision that a T would make. The tricky part is the S-N, I'm leaning more towards an N because he seems to have a thought out long range vision. So I'm going with INTJ.

    Just on a side note I thought the acting in this movie was brilliant, I haven't watched anything in the past couple of years that had such diverse character acting. All the leads were fantastic, and Ledger deserves an Oscar for playing a character so against his usual type.
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  7. #87
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    Warning bit fat SPOILERS below!

    Batman is almost always portrayed as an INTJ, from the comics to Adam West to Michael Keaton to etc.... However I think that Christian Bale's Batman is more of an ISTP.

    First of all the loner vigilante is more of an ISTP archetype anyway, so you need to look for where he breaks that stereotype to get him to be INTJ. Secondly most Batman portrayals have him as an obsessive compulsive planner which really solidifies him as an INTJ. ("I packed my Bat thermal underwear just in case Mr. Freeze launched an unexpected sneak attack.") Christian Bale's Batman does not have that. In fact usually Batman has more scientific expertise and designs his own gadgets, but Lucious Fox handles the gadgets this time.

    Lastly this Batman is more emotionally detached than other Batman portrayals. In the moment where his personal affections are tested the most Batman does not save his loved one. He makes the coldly rational choice (Ti) instead of the one that benefits him personally. That is an ISTP. INTJ's may be more thinker than feeler, but they are dominant intuitives. When someone really close to them is threatened they always save them first. Or if they didn't they would show a lot more regret and emotional distress afterward than the Christian Bale Batman did.

    This Batman a feeler? No way. After his girl died a feeler would have trouble getting out of bed the next morning, much less go out and fight crime. (In reality most feelers wouldn't hesitate to save the girl first.) What about all the moralizing? This Batman does a lot of emotionally detached moralizing, which is common for Ti. On the other hand Fi is moralizing with empathy. This Batman is moral but he isn't empathetic. (Just look at most of BlueWing's post on this site. He's the same way.)

    Overall this Batman shows himself to be coldly rational (Ti) with his decisions filtered through here and now perceptions (Se). In the first movie he seemed impulsive at times, but that is because of Se rather than any F. Christian Bale's Batman is an ISTP.
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  8. #88
    Welcome to Sunnyside Mondo's Avatar
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    This Batman a feeler? No way. After his girl died a feeler would have trouble getting out of bed the next morning, much less go out and fight crime. (In reality most feelers wouldn't hesitate to save the girl first.) What about all the moralizing? This Batman does a lot of emotionally detached moralizing, which is common for Ti. On the other hand Fi is moralizing with empathy. This Batman is moral but he isn't empathetic. (Just look at most of BlueWing's post on this site. He's the same way.)
    Batman went out to save the girl but the Joker lied about their locations- so he ended up saving Harvey instead.
    I still see more of N over S.
    If not in Batman, at least it's true for Bruce Wayne- a definite N.
    I'm starting to lean more towards INFP these days..
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  9. #89
    Junior Member RunnDMC's Avatar
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    The whole idea of batman and fear is so symbolic that it seems an ISTP wouldn't waste time with it.

  10. #90
    Boring old fossil Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mondo View Post
    Batman went out to save the girl but the Joker lied about their locations- so he ended up saving Harvey instead.
    Yes.

    As a sidenote, this is a common error; the Joker intentionally misled Batman so that he would mistakenly rescue Harvey Dent.

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