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  1. #1
    Member ChrisC99's Avatar
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    Default Some (possibly) mistyped historical figures?? (i.e. Mozart, Dickens, Seuss, Adams)

    Hi everyone! I haven't been on this forum in a year - my apologies. Grad school makes for a busy life Wonder if a lot of the same folks are still on here from when I last visited??

    ANYWAY...I've been thinking that some folks in history with a type more or less 'established' i.e. by Keirsey, seem to have been assessed more along the lines of the public PERCEPTION of them, their works or their career rather thyan what contemporaries actually documented them as acting like.

    FOR EXAMPLE:

    Mozart is typically referenced as an INTJ, because the popular notion envisions such a prolific composer as spending his days in silent contemplation. But by all accounts, there was little 'introverted' about the personality of Mozart; the film 'Amadeus' was an exaggeration, but only a slight one! He interacted with great minds, other musical talents and their families throughout Europe, making countless new acquaintances (friends and enemies alike) nearly everywhere he went, and staying in touch with them as the years went on. He was a known practical joker, who would leap over tables and chairs when he got bored from teaching music for too long, would attend carnivals in costume just to make people laugh, and write poems in lewd humor (and often multiple languages) set to music. He was also a poor future planner with a very disorganized lifestyle and no sense of managing money. He also had a hot temper, and could be sensitive to criticism. None of this seems to suggest I, J, or even T territory to me!

    Charles Dickens is often referred to as an ENFP. The sentiments in his BOOKS are certainly people-centered and filled with all manner of joyous interaction...but by all counts, Dickens himself did NOT enjoy the company of other people. The same goes for Dr. Seuss, now that I think about it.

    Johann Wolfgang von Goethe is often typed as an introverted thinker...again, I think because people are inclined to think of such a prolific and introspective writer and massive intellect as an introvert and thinker. His bouts of depression certainly made him shy away from the public eye at times...but those aside, he seems to be every definition of the extroverted thinker, seeking out interaction wherever possible and entertaining groups with long stories. He was also very, VERY emotional - having a quick (but easily appeasible) temper and inheriting his mother's deep sensitivity and compassion.

    Founding father John Adams is usually typed as an ENTP. But, he initially shied away from the public, preferring to live in privacy, giving in to pressure to enter the public eye only for the sake of the revolutionary cause. Even then, when he wasn't engaged in debate or making speeches he preferred privacy with his family...and once he retired from public life, he spent the last three decades of his life living alone on the family farm, rarely seen in public again. I don't think an extrovert could HANDLE that kind of a retirement! Ben Franklin for example, who WAS the epitome of an ENTP through and through, kept traveling and receiving hordes of visitors to the day of his death whenever his health permitted; he claimed to feel sick if he went more than a few days without doing so. Furthermore, Adams doesn't seem to have had the emotional detachment to have been a T; he liked structure and formalities, but he took almost EVERYTHING personally!

    What do y'all think??

  2. #2
    ndovjtjcaqidthi
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    Since when did people start thinking that Mozart was an INTJ?... Lmao. Never heard that before.

    And about Goethe, no doubt he was an INFJ.

  3. #3
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    I've seen Mozart mostly being referred to as an ESFP, which is most probably correct.

    @ChrisC99, what type do you think Dickens was then?

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    Charles Dickens was an usually complicated person. At times he was very quiet and would go on walks with his children or friends and not say a word for hours. Also, he could sit and write for five, six, seven hours a day with no interruptions. On the other hand, when he was younger he had a game where he liked to hang out of a third floor window and try to drop cherries into people's hats walking on the path below, and he always managed to charm his way out of trouble. He loved to give public performances of plays and his stories, and loved the attention. Also, he was very domineering and in-charge of nearly everyone he came into contact with - he used people like a chess player would move a pawn. He also had some weird beliefs, like believing that sleeping facing north improved your writing ability (and, considering his amazing skill, who are we to doubt that haha?) ENFP seems a decent shot at typing him.

  5. #5
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    Gandhi is often typed INFJ.

    I think he may have been INFP. Everything about his life and struggles suggests unbending, unwavering Fi in the face of overwhelming odds.

    His philosophy of passive resistance and LIVING one's ideals...it just seems more Fi to me.

    Also, his rejection of and disregard for the caste system--I think an INFP, more than any other type (even the other NFs) would have little use for what they might see to be a superficial and outdated way of ranking people and keeping them bound in mental slavery. The British Empire took advantage of this system and used it to keep the Indian people subjugated and Gandhi was fully aware of this.

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    George Washington...occasionally typed as ISTJ because he was perceived as being quiet and reserved...

    In actuality, he tended to keep his mouth shut because he had very bad teeth from a young age.

    I say ESTJ. He was a natural leader and a good logistics man. Not the best strategist though. But he generally made good use of his underlings...he had an eye for talent and accordingly chose his generals.

    He was also known to be energetic and good in a supervisory role, despite being a man of few words.

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    I also think Jefferson may have been an INTJ, despite frequent typings as INTP...but I would need to refresh my memory on his life and writings before making this assessment

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyedecker View Post
    I also think Jefferson may have been an INTJ, despite frequent typings as INTP...but I would need to refresh my memory on his life and writings before making this assessment
    I read a biography about him about a year ago and couldn't really relate at all, so I doubt he's INTP. Probably an IN-J type.

  9. #9
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    @Lyedecker - one one of the points of Fi is that it does not express its ideals in any readily available manner - that unlike the Fe type, which expresses itself purely and is therefore 'free' of presence in the mind, Fi adheres to typical notions of repression, that the source of feeling is never touched upon nor emptied, only sublimed by minute facets of the type's actions.

    I think INFJ may fit better, still.

  10. #10
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    Perhaps.

    I'm still sticking with INFP.

    I never said I was good at typing others and very well may be wrong, it's just a general vibe I get from what I know of his life and writings.

    He also meditated regularly. Meditation on a regular basis changes how the brain and mind operate. I'm curious how Fi might look in an extremely disciplined and enlightened person. In that case, it might be very difficult to distinguish from Fe. It's possible he had trained his mind to the point of utilizing both.

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