MBTI Type and Political Affiliation..

[21%]

'Liberal left' here -- whatever that means.

I think Fe goes well with socialism...

 

[Lark]

Why do you say this? I think the correlation is perfectly obvious. NTs should tend towards libertarian views (this does not mean ALL NTs, nor does it mean NTs are strict libertarians, but the general tendancy should be valid).

The key tenant of libertarianism is that people should more or less be left to their own devices as long as they don't stomp all over others in the process. Such an approach seems emminently logical to me in general, so it appeals to my NT worldview although I am not a strict libertarian. I would expect other NTs to feel the same way, and this article seems to confirm my expectation.

Yeah, what you are highlighting here is an emotional attachment to an ideology, it would strike me as fired by introversion and feeling/emoting.

The reason why I think that there isnt a correlation is that there classic ASSumption in libertarianism is that its rational, patently rational, your own reductivist description is illustrative of what I'm talking about but that has been blown apart by left and right wing critics YEARS ago, when that satanic creedo emerged in its first form, classical economics and classical liberalism.

On the right wing Southy, Coleridge and others attacked it as promoting class struggles or favouring certain classes in those struggles and having all sorts of unintended consequences, on the left Marx and others attacked it as by no means a scientific theory or attempt at scientific theorising any longer but an ideology serving certain vested interests and social classes (this could equally be said of socialism in practice but that's another question).

If you're a thinker at all you're not going to be too satisfied by an ideology and much less a shallow and naive one such as libertarianism.

 

[Lark]

So these people who have posted in this thread(including me) are a bunch of idiots because you disagree with the comments,

Nope, not because they are my comments but because they are mistaken. Wilfully.

how about instead of acting like a self-righteous know it all try offering counter valid points instead of personally insulting people, I'm so tried of that bullshit on this forum(like in that pathetic Everyday Sexism thread). There are people who are ignorant(we have to start at somewhere) but willing to learn more but when they encounter this crap on this forum it will turn many off and why not.

Is there a hash tag for useless emoting?

 

[Little_Sticks]

I lived with an ESTP and my mom is ISFP. They were both strongly Republican in the last election. If I said anything suggesting that there were negatives to the Republicans, I would get a long frustrating lecture on how I was mistaken.

So no...this is a huge generalization of people...

But heh, typology here mostly ends up being trait-fitting, rigid dichotomous thinking, over-generalizing, and stereotypes anyway, so yeah this is probably about right for what the theory is capable of doing.

I consider myself ISFJ and I believe a benevolent dictatorship is the best form of government, making me a die-hard independent. Bet no one saw that coming.

 

[DoctorCroupy#9]

Yeah, what you are highlighting here is an emotional attachment to an ideology, it would strike me as fired by introversion and feeling/emoting.

The reason why I think that there isnt a correlation is that there classic ASSumption in libertarianism is that its rational, patently rational, your own reductivist description is illustrative of what I'm talking about but that has been blown apart by left and right wing critics YEARS ago, when that satanic creedo emerged in its first form, classical economics and classical liberalism.

On the right wing Southy, Coleridge and others attacked it as promoting class struggles or favouring certain classes in those struggles and having all sorts of unintended consequences, on the left Marx and others attacked it as by no means a scientific theory or attempt at scientific theorising any longer but an ideology serving certain vested interests and social classes (this could equally be said of socialism in practice but that's another question).

If you're a thinker at all you're not going to be too satisfied by an ideology and much less a shallow and naive one such as libertarianism.

So you think that all NTs would disown a political ideology because "right wing Southy, Coleridge and others attacked it"

I have to be honest, I had quite a time trying to understand what the hell you were trying to say. Partly because the point you were trying to make was supported by only your opinion and the sporadic opinions of others, and partly because your grammar is horrid. It had absolutely nothing to do with the question at hand: Does the NT temperament have correlation with Libertarian views? All you did was tell me why YOU disagree with their views haha. You don't get to speak on behalf of all NTs (thank God).

If making the word 'ass' in the word 'assumption' even more obvious to the naked eye is the most you can contribute to this debate, then I welcome you to exit before you embarrass yourself even more.

 

[Lark]

I disagreed with you. Can you care to explain exactly why you're so against the idea that the NT temperament can have correlations with Libertarian views?

Instead of saying how mistaken you think we are, how about you prove, with concrete evidence, why we're mistaken


(When you finally figure out it's merely your opinion and not fact, I'll gladly accept your ham-fisted apology haha)

You'll be a long time waiting, if you were interested you could read the thread and find the posts, the same as if you were interested you could read any of the myriad sources there out there when forming your opinion instead of going with, you know, what feels right and giving it some backing from poor MBTI supposition.

Or you could carry on trying to appear smart when you're out classed. Up to you.

 

[DoctorCroupy#9]

I responded by editing my prior post. The 'reply wasn't working for whatever reason. Now that it is, I've copy and pasted it. Have at it, Lark.

Yeah, what you are highlighting here is an emotional attachment to an ideology, it would strike me as fired by introversion and feeling/emoting.

The reason why I think that there isnt a correlation is that there classic ASSumption in libertarianism is that its rational, patently rational, your own reductivist description is illustrative of what I'm talking about but that has been blown apart by left and right wing critics YEARS ago, when that satanic creedo emerged in its first form, classical economics and classical liberalism.

On the right wing Southy, Coleridge and others attacked it as promoting class struggles or favouring certain classes in those struggles and having all sorts of unintended consequences, on the left Marx and others attacked it as by no means a scientific theory or attempt at scientific theorising any longer but an ideology serving certain vested interests and social classes (this could equally be said of socialism in practice but that's another question).

If you're a thinker at all you're not going to be too satisfied by an ideology and much less a shallow and naive one such as libertarianism.

So you think that all NTs would disown a political ideology because "right wing Southy, Coleridge and others attacked it"..

I have to be honest, I had quite a time trying to understand what the hell you were trying to say. Partly because the point you were trying to make was supported by only your opinion and the sporadic opinions of others, and partly because your grammar is horrid. It had absolutely nothing to do with the question at hand: Does the NT temperament have correlation with Libertarian views? All you did was tell me why YOU disagree with their views haha. You don't get to speak on behalf of all NTs (thank God).

If making the word 'ass' in the word 'assumption' even more obvious to the naked eye is the most you can contribute to this debate, then I welcome you to exit before you embarrass yourself even more.

 

[Lark]

I responded by editing my prior post.

I've responded by putting you on ignore, who the hell do you think you are editing my posts?

 

[DoctorCroupy#9]

Hey dipsh*t, I said MY prior post xD

 

[Robopop]

Is there a hash tag for useless emoting?

Kind of an ironic statement huh, from the way you responded to the thread, it seems like you got somehow personally offended by being associated with an ideology you loath, I don't know you that much but from reading your posts and the times I've commented with you the way you reacted seems kind of surprising and uncharacteristic, is this shadow Lark or something.

 

[DoctorCroupy#9]

It's obvious this is a subject he's just very passionate about, hence all the emotionally charged "I don't agree with it because I don't agree" circular arguments. He probably didn't mean to come off as so rude and narrow-minded.

 

[Little_Sticks]

ummmm

 

[DoctorCroupy#9]

ummmm

...brella.

I know. I could have held back a bit, too. Don't judge me haha I like debates

 

[SensEye]

If you're a thinker at all you're not going to be too satisfied by an ideology and much less a shallow and naive one such as libertarianism.

Strict libertarianism I agree. But if you are a thinker you are likely to have libertarian leanings. As opposed to say, right wing conservative leanings, or bleeding heart liberal leanings, or communist/socialist leanings.

Anyways, you and I can differ on opinion, but the survey results seem to support my expectations, which I don't find surprising. Perhaps you do, but I think you are letting your personal bias (you seem anti-libertarian) color your judgement about how most NTs are likely to think.

 

[Lark]

Strict libertarianism I agree. But if you are a thinker you are likely to have libertarian leanings. As opposed to say, right wing conservative leanings, or bleeding heart liberal leanings, or communist/socialist leanings.

Anyways, you and I can differ on opinion, but the survey results seem to support my expectations, which I don't find surprising. Perhaps you do, but I think you are letting your personal bias (you seem anti-libertarian) color your judgement about how most NTs are likely to think.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationalization_(making_excuses)

Go read. Learn. Become as smart as you'd like to believe you are.

 

[Coriolis]

I think one might find a correlation between Te and right wing ideologies and conversely for Fi and left wing ideologies.

What does this predict about INTJs? We use both.

Strict libertarianism I agree. But if you are a thinker you are likely to have libertarian leanings. As opposed to say, right wing conservative leanings, or bleeding heart liberal leanings, or communist/socialist leanings.

Thinkers, and NTs in particular, value independence and competence, so there may be some tendency toward political views based on non-interference and personal responsibility. I wouldn't call myself conservative, liberal, socialist, or libertarian, but then I have always hesitated to put labels on my views, political or otherwise.

I often come across as a liberal here, since more of the positions I have discussed coincide with liberal views. Others are much more conservative, however. When I look at what my positions on various issues have in common, it is a balance between individual liberty/responsibility and equality of opportunity. The first part means the government - ALL levels of government - and everyone else should leave me alone and let me do what I want, provided it doesn't interfere with others' right to do the same. This sounds very hands-off libertarian, but I also recognize that only the government, and the federal government at that, has the power to prevent all other entities from encroaching on individual liberty. The second part means that it is in everyone's best interests, individually and collectively, to maintain as level a playing field as possible. This way, someone's outcome in life more directly reflects their desires and efforts, rather than luck or the poor choices of others (e.g. parents). As a result, I have taken positions that fall within each of the four categories you list above at one time or another. My views do not coincide neatly with any one.

 

[DoctorCroupy#9]

Strict libertarianism I agree. But if you are a thinker you are likely to have libertarian leanings. As opposed to say, right wing conservative leanings, or bleeding heart liberal leanings, or communist/socialist leanings.

Anyways, you and I can differ on opinion, but the survey results seem to support my expectations, which I don't find surprising. Perhaps you do, but I think you are letting your personal bias (you seem anti-libertarian) color your judgement about how most NTs are likely to think.

Exactly. No matter how many times you say this, Lark will insist his opinion is fact, all the while backing up his 'facts' by quoting the opinions of others. It's all just circular reasoning haha.

 

[SensEye]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationalization_(making_excuses)

Go read. Learn. Become as smart as you'd like to believe you are.

Admittedly, our data is scarce. Still, such as it is it confirms my bias and not yours. I'm not sure where on the political spectrum you think NTs fall, since all I've got to go on is your completely unsubstantiated assertion that the correlation between NT's and libertarianism "is dumb".

You are the one that needs to read your second link. Rationalization is one of the first things that people do when their bias is not confirmed. Your next sentence is an example of the second. Here's a link for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
[MENTION=16891]Sgt. Pepper[/MENTION] - yeah I can see where this is going. Lark can have the last word. As you mentioned upthread when you refered to being surprised this was a touchy subject, it simply isn't that important to me.

 

[Lark]

Admittedly, our data is scarce. Still, such as it is it confirms my bias and not yours. I'm not sure where on the political spectrum you think NTs fall, since all I've got to go on is your completely unsubstantiated assertion that the correlation between NT's and libertarianism "is dumb".

You are the one that needs to read your second link. Rationalization is one of the first things that people do when their bias is not confirmed. Your next sentence is an example of the second. Here's a link for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

[MENTION=16891]Sgt. Pepper[/MENTION] - yeah I can see where this is going. Lark can have the last word. As you mentioned upthread when you refered to being surprised this was a touchy subject, it simply isn't that important to me.

Its not about having the last word, for someone who is setting out their stand as a thinker you've displayed a lot of feeling language in your posts.

The reality is that this is poor research, conducted with the sole purpose of confirming a hypothesis, its bad science and bad reasonings but it is great rationalisation, now you can consider rationalisations as simply a tag to toss around and attribute as you see fit or you can consider the structure of your argument and see if it is rooted in it or not, its your choice and ultimately will relate to what I was talking about, are you more interested in critical appraisal or simply confirming parallels between your favourite cognitive functions and political ideologies?

I'm inclined towards some socialist and some conservative thinking, I didnt say that either are correlated with any cognitive functions, particularly thinking because I'd say that a true thinker is more inclined to be ambivalent about ideologies than a standard barer but whatever. Its not an intellectual pissing match, I was trying to clue you in but maybe you're not at that point yet and you're satisfied with less.

 

[Shudder]

I just read through this and wow. I feel like this whole spat could have been avoided if everyone just realized it was all for fun. There's no way to prove it either which way. There was no need to get hostile and take it so personally. It looks like this was just supposed to be a fun conversation. no need to spit all over the idea just because you disagree. Ya gotta enjoy life a bit Lark haha


and for me, it's pretty much spot on. I definitely lean a bit libertarian in my views.