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Thread: Richard Dawkins

  1. #41
    Senior Member Emotionalogic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superunknown View Post
    No, he is an extraverted thinker because his primary domain of interest is the objective universe, which happens to take root in the physical sciences moreso than much else.

    "Just as Darwin might possibly represent the normal extraverted thinking type, so we might point to Kant as a counter-example of the normal introverted thinking type. The former speaks with facts; the latter appeals to the subjective factor. Darwin ranges over the wide fields of objective facts, while Kant restricts himself to a critique of knowledge in general. But suppose a Cuvier be contrasted with a Nietzsche: the antithesis becomes even sharper."

    Read up on your Jung? It goes well beyond the intuitive accessibility of MBTI, from derivation of morality to the establishment of belief systems, even so far as to include the varying propensities for ideological fortitude.
    By that standard, every scientist would be te, and every philosopher ti. Nietzsche is the pre-eminent INTJ, with his focus on perspectivism (ni), imposing your will upon the world (te), a personal code of morality that doesn't match Christianity or society (fi), and "saying yes to life" (se). In that order, no less. Typology has evolved a great deal since Jung, although he's still relevant. The idea that "atheistic naturalism" and having "the physical sciences" as your "primary domain of interest" makes you a te user is beyond ridiculous. Typology does not measure beliefs or interests. Period.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Emotionalogic View Post
    By that standard, every scientist would be te, and every philosopher ti. Nietzsche is the pre-eminent INTJ, with his focus on perspectivism (ni), imposing your will upon the world (te), a personal code of morality that doesn't match Christianity or society (fi), and "saying yes to life" (se). In that order, no less. Typology has evolved a great deal since Jung, although he's still relevant. The idea that "atheistic naturalism" and having "the physical sciences" as your "primary domain of interest" makes you a te user is beyond ridiculous. Typology does not measure beliefs or interests. Period.
    Wow, you have like the same exact ideologies as another Nietzchian who just joined this forum, and that person happens to be @Redkix.

    I'm curious as to what you folks might think about my favorite philosopher, Giordano Bruno (who, like Nietzsche, challenged the old boundaries and laid foundations for self-mastery and a new world [and he also, unlike Nietzsche, designed a blueprint as to the overall structure of our cosmos]).

    Here's my favorite Bruno quote and poem below - if you don't mind, offer your opinions:

    Thou art my delight and the warmth of my heart;
    Thou makest me without fear of Fate or of Death;
    Thou breakest the chains and bars
    Whence few come forth free.
    Seasons, years, months, days and hours
    The children and weapons of Time and that Court
    Where neither steel nor treasure avail
    Have secured me from the fury of the foe.
    Henceforth I spread confident wings to space;
    I fear no barrier of crystal or of glass;
    I cleave the heavens and soar to the infinite.
    And while I rise from my own globe to others
    And penetrate ever further through the eternal field,
    That which others saw from afar, I leave far behind me.

    "Unless you make yourself equal to God, you cannot understand God: for the like is not intelligible save to the like. Make yourself grow to a greatness beyond measure, by a bound free yourself from the body; raise yourself above all time, become Eternity; then you will understand God. Believe that nothing is impossible for you, think yourself immortal and capable of understanding all, all arts, all sciences, the nature of every living being. Mount higher than the highest height; descend lower than the lowest depth. Draw into yourself all sensations of everything created, fire and water, dry and moist, imagining that you are everywhere, on earth, in the sea, in the sky, that you are not yet born, in the maternal womb, adolescent, old, dead, beyond death. If you embrace in your thought all things at once, times, places, substances, qualities, quantities, you may understand God." - Giordano Bruno

    Now, let's compare that with my favorite Nietzsche quote:

    "The will is a world architect and composer, the will is a world power and mover. The world is shaped in the image of our wills and by the power of our wills. Will has essentially the nature of a force. Like all forces, will has a magnitude and a direction, and just like things move in the direction of the strongest force, things move in the direction of the strongest will. Whenever you loose something, you faced a greater will and were overpowered by it. If you want something to happen strongly enough, if the world wants something to happen strongly enough, then it is going to happen. The will is a creator. Will is a living organism, it grows and develops along with the individual. Weak individuals are characterized by a weak will or lack of will. Ill people are known by an ill will or a destructive will. Hence the presence and development of will is absolutely essential for personal and spiritual ascension. The key to the higher and diviner life is a strong and healthy will, a will to improve, a will to exceed, a will to life, but most importantly a will to ascend. The seed transforms into a flower by a will to ascend in the instrument. The will to ascend is an elevator to the higher levels of being, a key to unlock the higher potentials of life and a power to manifest them. I do want to climb a high mountain today!" - Friedrich Nietzsche

  3. #43
    Senior Member Emotionalogic's Avatar
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    Well, since there is no God, and there never will be, the only worthwhile course of action is to become the God of your own life. Not in an attempt to understand God (there's nothing to understand), but for it's own sake. In that sense, my views are closer to Nietzsche than Bruno. Not that I have anything against Bruno. Anyone murdered by the Catholic Church must have done something right.

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    Senior Member Robopop's Avatar
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    He seems heavily Te oriented, he gives me a very NTJ vibe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Emotionalogic View Post
    Well, since there is no God, and there never will be, the only worthwhile course of action is to become the God of your own life..
    There is no God, but you must be a God of your own life. More than a little contradictory.

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    Senior Member Emotionalogic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taylord View Post
    There is no God, but you must be a God of your own life. More than a little contradictory.
    Yes, either that or I was speaking metaphorically.

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    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Ni way of looking at the world based on Te data is pretty obvious from everything he does.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

    Read

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    ENTJ. I see him typed as INTJ a lot, but I think his Ni is in service of Te, not the other way around.
    Likes asynartetic liked this post

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    Quote Originally Posted by WALMART View Post
    No, he is an extraverted thinker because his primary domain of interest is the objective universe, which happens to take root in the physical sciences moreso than much else.

    "Just as Darwin might possibly represent the normal extraverted thinking type, so we might point to Kant as a counter-example of the normal introverted thinking type. The former speaks with facts; the latter appeals to the subjective factor. Darwin ranges over the wide fields of objective facts, while Kant restricts himself to a critique of knowledge in general. But suppose a Cuvier be contrasted with a Nietzsche: the antithesis becomes even sharper."

    Read up on your Jung? It goes well beyond the intuitive accessibility of MBTI, from derivation of morality to the establishment of belief systems, even so far as to include the varying propensities for ideological fortitude.
    how are you so right?

  10. #50
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    Dawkins IS the extraverted thinking type Jung described. Down to the letter:

    "In accordance with his definition, we must picture a man whose constant aim in so far, of course, as he is a pure type is to bring his total life-activities into relation with intellectual conclusions, which in the last resort are always orientated by objective data, whether objective facts or generally valid ideas. This type of man gives, the deciding voice not merely for himself alone but also on behalf of his entourage either to the actual objective reality or to its objectively orientated, intellectual formula.

    By this formula are good and evil measured, and beauty and ugliness determined. All is right that corresponds with this formula ; all is wrong that contradicts it ; and everything that is neutral to it is purely accidental. Because this formula seems to correspond with the meaning of the world, it also becomes a world-law whose realization must be achieved at all times and seasons, both individually and collectively. Just as the extraverted thinking type subordinates himself to his formula, so, for its own good, must his entourage also obey it, since the man who refuses to obey is wrong he is resisting the world-law, and is, therefore, unreasonable, immoral, and without a conscience. His moral code forbids him to tolerate exceptions ; his ideal must, under all circumstances, be realized; for in his eyes it is the purest conceivable formulation of objective reality, and, therefore, must also be generally valid truth, quite indispensable for the salvation of man. This is not from any great love for his neighbour, but from a higher standpoint of justice and truth."


    His philosophy is totally sophomoric. It is all Te. Like even his entire life work is just a sloppy metaphor that lacks Ti precision. And then a guy like Ernst Mayr comes around and says it is a useless analogy, and "reductionism beyond useful analysis" That is Te. He leaves himself wide open with no precision. He relies on strength of metaphor to obscure lack of precision.

    He doesn't even realize his life's work, the popularization of the gene centered view, is actually a philosophical question, and not a scientific one. He is totally dogmatic within science. Dawkins is a bulldog of his side. He rose through the ranks by being a mediocre scientist. Simply by selling himself. An INTP could never do that. Dawkins is a glory hunter. He doesn't care about exploring ideas, as much as defending and pushing them on people. TJ. His entire career is based on pushing one particular side of evolutionary theory and fighting off all comers with ferocity. He has effortlessly navigated and risen through power systems his entire life. He is the ultimate achiever.

    I refer to this archetype as the "ESTJ preacher". Like John Lithgow's character from Footloose. The preacher who wants to outlaw dancing. That is Dawkins. The idea being pushed is irrelevant and interchangeable. Ti has depth of structure. Richard Dawkins is one of the shallowest thinkers around. The guy like literally doesn't think. He just puts his head down and drives through people. He is just carrying the football. Watching him try to answer questions that can't be answered concretely, without objective reference, and he is a child.

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