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View Poll Results: Khaleesi

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  • INFP

    10 25.64%
  • ISFP

    9 23.08%
  • INFJ

    15 38.46%
  • INTJ

    2 5.13%
  • other MBTI

    7 17.95%
  • 9w8

    3 7.69%
  • 9w1

    1 2.56%
  • 1w9

    8 20.51%
  • 1w2

    4 10.26%
  • 8w9

    3 7.69%
  • 1w2

    1 2.56%
  • 2w1

    2 5.13%
  • 6w7

    4 10.26%
  • 6w5

    2 5.13%
  • other Enneagram

    1 2.56%
  • Sp/Sx

    5 12.82%
  • Sx/Sp

    2 5.13%
  • Sx/So

    6 15.38%
  • So/Sx

    4 10.26%
  • Sp/So or So/Sp

    2 5.13%
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Results 41 to 50 of 92

  1. #41
    Senior Member Rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    I don't need to site evidence every time I say something (that's a very TJ-ish expectation btw)

    Daenyres at the beginning of the book is passive, confused, self forgetting and tossed around by the tides of life not knowing what she really wants. throughout the story she learns to take initiative, stand up for herself, go after what she wants and face the real world. throughout the story she becomes more and more commanding and a stronger, more decisive leader. I can't think of anything more 9w8 --> 3
    Feeler reaction... (just answering in the same fashion :P )

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  2. #42
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    an 8 wouldn't. allowing someone to control and abuse them the way Khaleesi does at the start of the story would go against every fiber of the 8 fixation. 8s are VERY slow to let people into their inner circle, even family members, and they're not going to allow themselves to get close to someone who does that to them (they have a hard enough time getting close to people who treat them well)
    PS: a 7 wouldn't either (in fact, with the exception of 3w2, none of the Id types would). that's much more of a 2/9 thing or maybe a phobic 6 or 4
    Exactly, its hard to put someone in your social circle in a way where you allow them to affect you.. Which is why it is also hard for us to let go of people. It goes beyond types and motivators and enneagrams.. He is her only surviving family member. He was the only family she had. And really, her only friend. When she married, she was able to create more bonds--and thus gained the ability to steer away from him.. but survival is a constant theme in the book. I don't think that her putting up with her brother's bad business disqualifies her as an 8. We're not completely heartless, and we're not completely strong either (though we wish we were).. we still NEED people in our lives. She needed someone in her life.. and her brother was the closest she had for a long, long time.
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  3. #43
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    Exactly, its hard to put someone in your social circle in a way where you allow them to affect you.. Which is why it is also hard for us to let go of people. It goes beyond types and motivators and enneagrams.. He is her only surviving family member. He was the only family she had. And really, her only friend. When she married, she was able to create more bonds--and thus gained the ability to steer away from him.. but survival is a constant theme in the book. I don't think that her putting up with her brother's bad business disqualifies her as an 8. We're not completely heartless, and we're not completely strong either (though we wish we were).. we still NEED people in our lives. She needed someone in her life.. and her brother was the closest she had for a long, long time.
    still, if she were an 8, there would have at least been a LOT more tension between them. even if she loved him and he was the only person she had close to her, 8s respond very belligerently/aggressively when people attempt to mistreat and control them (this isn't just your brother being a dick, he was a physically abusive, pathological narcissist). sorry, but I didn't see much 8 in her at all. what made you think she was a core 8?
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  4. #44
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    still, if she were an 8, there would have at least been a LOT more tension between them. even if she loved him and he was the only person she had close to her, 8s respond very belligerently/aggressively when people attempt to mistreat and control them (this isn't just your brother being a dick, he was a physically abusive, pathological narcissist). sorry, but I didn't see much 8 in her at all. what made you think she was a core 8?
    Because everything she does as a full grown woman screams eight. Even with verbal and physical abuse she wouldn't allow that sort of psychologically damaging drama cause her to bat an eyelash. Because she dealt with her brother pushing her around and masking her potential as a child, she refuses to allow anyone to do her wrong and push her around now. She doesn't even like the common courtesies of leaders--she frequently thinks of things as useless tasks she must endure for her ambitions. She was a child, remember, not always the powerful queen she turned out to be. A child with a LOT of enemies, in a cruel world, with the only person in the world at her side that knew who her mother and father was and remembers them... It is understandable that she tolerated him. I'd stop it at tolerate though.

    There was enough tension between them that she allowed him to be murdered right infront of her.. thats tension enough for me. She rarely gives him a thought outside of the fact that she really wishes that her other brother had been allowed to live as she might have married him, and a few fond memories of the rare times he was sweet to her. She doesn't mourn his loss really.. He wasn't a pivotal figure in her life.. He was just all she had. When she got something more, she was quick to shed the 'turn a blind eye and endure it, you have to survive' mentality.

    Her ability to
    I don't know how the series is protraying her, but in the book she is a fierce, clever, amazing type 8. She is a true mother at heart, and she has a big one, but she WAS born to be a queen and everything she does screams it. She is an independent woman, an ambitious one that listens to her instincts (even to a fault--most people would be logical about walking into fire.. but not her! Instincts trump everything with it.. she's listened to her gut since day 1) and doesn't let people push her around.
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  5. #45
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    Because everything she does as a full grown woman screams eight. Even with verbal and physical abuse she wouldn't allow that sort of psychologically damaging drama cause her to bat an eyelash. Because she dealt with her brother pushing her around and masking her potential as a child, she refuses to allow anyone to do her wrong and push her around now. She doesn't even like the common courtesies of leaders--she frequently thinks of things as useless tasks she must endure for her ambitions. She was a child, remember, not always the powerful queen she turned out to be. A child with a LOT of enemies, in a cruel world, with the only person in the world at her side that knew who her mother and father was and remembers them... It is understandable that she tolerated him. I'd stop it at tolerate though.
    There was enough tension between them that she allowed him to be murdered right infront of her.. thats tension enough for me. She rarely gives him a thought outside of the fact that she really wishes that her other brother had been allowed to live as she might have married him, and a few fond memories of the rare times he was sweet to her. She doesn't mourn his loss really.. He wasn't a pivotal figure in her life.. He was just all she had. When she got something more, she was quick to shed the 'turn a blind eye and endure it, you have to survive' mentality.
    Her ability to
    I don't know how the series is protraying her, but in the book she is a fierce, clever, amazing type 8. She is a true mother at heart, and she has a big one, but she WAS born to be a queen and everything she does screams it. She is an independent woman, an ambitious one that listens to her instincts (even to a fault--most people would be logical about walking into fire.. but not her! Instincts trump everything with it.. she's listened to her gut since day 1) and doesn't let people push her around.
    these are positive symptoms of type 8, traits that anyone could develop (and traits that many would develop under such circumstances, regardless of type), but truth be told, she is not a natural leader. for the first part of her life, she is a confused doormat with no will of her own (I'm not trying to say that 8 children are born with the ability to be vengeful, terrifying queens, but from the time they are born, the type 8 child has a VERY strong will, something that will be evident even before age 5, much less 17. 8s do not need to learn to have a will of their own, be assertive and fight back when mistreated, these are instinctual responses for them). Khaleesi's strength, independence and ambition are the result of nurture, not nature.
    also, as you said, you are evaluating her behavior as a grown woman, but the best time to evaluate one's enneagram is when they are younger (I made this mistake in my own typing, and if I were typing based on myself as I am now, I would be typed as a 7w6)
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  6. #46
    Senior Member Cloud of Thunder's Avatar
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    I voted INFJ 1w9 Sx/So.

  7. #47
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    these are positive symptoms of type 8, traits that anyone could develop (and traits that many would develop under such circumstances, regardless of type), but truth be told, she is not a natural leader. for the first part of her life, she is a confused doormat with no will of her own (I'm not trying to say that 8 children are born with the ability to be vengeful, terrifying queens, but from the time they are born, the type 8 child has a VERY strong will, something that will be evident even before age 5, much less 17. 8s do not need to learn to have a will of their own, be assertive and fight back when mistreated, these are instinctual responses for them). Khaleesi's strength, independence and ambition are the result of nurture, not nature.
    also, as you said, you are evaluating her behavior as a grown woman, but the best time to evaluate one's enneagram is when they are younger (I made this mistake in my own typing, and if I were typing based on myself as I am now, I would be typed as a 7w6)
    Given the circumstances I mentioned--needing her brother to have a connection to the family, being abused so long, it is understandable why she was repressed until she was safe. Even a type 8 is still a logical, sensible person.. She lives in a world where women don't have much power, and are raped and killed all the time for no reason at all. Even her brother saw the value in her, so she was safe with him.. as safe as being with a crazy man can get anyways. She isnt stupid, she's going to survive, and surviving means being on the good side of someone.

    I don't think we can go based on her childhood in particular because of the abusive situation she had to endure--not just from her brother.. she spent her life running away. Being hidden. Keeping her head down, mouth shut, and feet moving dutifully was all that kept her and her brother alive for a time. The king's men would have gladly raped and murdered her and been paid well to do it. Type doesn't really come into play here. Its simple survival. She didnt really get to have a 'life' where she could afford to think about herself, what she wants, and where she wants to be until she married Drogo. It was the beginning of her life, the first chapter in the Game of Thrones series. Her life as something more than a beggar and a runner scared for her life at every corner. If you judge her type at all, it should be from the time she got to BE herself, instead of just living and surviving.

    Everyone is the same type when they're merely surviving. How you think and what you want and the way you do things requires you to have those luxuries in the first place.
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  8. #48
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    You're offering some reasons that could have easily applied to her brother (living in fear and on the run). Yet, he had a huge ego and talked shit to other bonafide 8s (like Drago). And if it was a female thing, then Arya and Cersei defy it. Hell, even that redheaded whore is bold in her own way.

  9. #49
    Blood of the Exile Animal's Avatar
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    I'm on the 5th episode of Season 2, but I'd say she's a clear 8w9.

    In the first scene, I thought she might be a 4. She was looking longingly out into the distance, and had a look of sadness and longing about her. She was also being abused and overpowered by her brother, which said "masochism" to me.

    But then I saw how she responded when she saw a way out, and had a little bit of power and control. I don't know what her other options were to escape from her brother in the beginning, but the way her character panned out, I saw clear 8ish tendencies. Her brother was envious of her (though I'd type him at CP-6, easily) ... but she did not envy her husband Drogo, nor her brother, nor men who had more power. She simply, patiently and strategically (line to 5) climbed her way to the top (8) and did so compassionately, with a very motherly, nurturing approach (line to 2).

    All of the classic "symptoms" of 8 are there. She has all the connecting lines, clearly displayed; a very clear goal and motive, finds it easy to accept her power and use it, but only on HER terms. She doesn't fall into line with the ways of the tribe; instead, she makes her own rules and decides what kind of queen she wants to be, and takes it upon herself to work towards it in a goal-oriented manner. She's also direct about what she intends and what she believes. She doesn't question her instincts in those regards and displays strong gut tendencies. She also has the recklessness of an 8; she can be impulsive in terms of trusting her gut.

    Her sadism shows in the way she acts towards her brother. She watches Drogo pour metal over his head, and watches him burn. Deep down, I would say she wanted revenge on him and she got it, and it gave her satisfaction. She still showed him compassion, on the surface, but the way she went about everything just showed to me that she did have that sadism underneath, where she was satisfied by being in control and watching her brother slowly lose power while her power grew. Though she did not take revenge into her own hands, I would still say that deep down, she had satisfaction at obtaining that revenge, and she felt that it was deserved. She also enacts revenge upon the woman who killed Drogo and her baby, and deceived her; but then again, who wouldn't? =p. Still, the manner in which she did it is telling. She announces that anyone who betrays her will die screaming, and that the woman will scream against her will. The woman screams and everyone sees. She smiles. This is vengeance and sadism. It's also a show of power through public shaming. It shows everyone that as compassionate and lovely as she is, if you fuck with her, you will die making a fool of yourself, screaming in front of everyone, without honor.

    Also, I thought it was rather 8ish, at the end of the first season, when she stood before Drogo's corpse and told her followers that they're free to go, but if they stay, they will follow her, etc. Autonomy is an important value to an 8, and she wants people she can trust; people who believe in her and won't betray her. She gave them their autonomy; gave them a clear choice: follow me, or don't. Go free , if you don't want to. That particular approach seems 8ish because of the value in autonomy, but also, the awareness that if people are forced to follow you, they're more likely to betray you. So it was self-preservational, as well as kind and direct; and wise.

    She does display naivety in some ways, but I think it's important for people not to idealize 8s in this manner. Nobody is born perfect, not 8s, not anyone. Nobody is born knowing everything. But on top of that, crucial to the make-up of the 8 is the dichotomy: Lust AND Innocence. An 8 will have lust, but also the virtue of innocence within. Innocence will be displayed when an 8 is in her prime; when an 8 has power, and plenty to spare, it's likely she'll feel that she *can* live by her ideals. 8s also have a childhood-orientation which binds the 8 to the goals, dreams, plans, and visions that the 8 had in childhood. This will register as "innocence," and any way that an 8 can bring this into her life will make her feel more healthy. Power gives the chance to enact those values. For instance, in our world, if you earn all the money you need, you can then contribute to charity, thus supporting the things that you believed in as a kid. You can make your own schedule; not worry about anyone else's rules. You can buy time to work on something you're passionate about or take lessons in something that interests you, or travel and explore, or collect your favorite childhood trinket. Also, keeping in mind that the 8's soul-child is at point 2, these childhood passions and values might easily include giving to others; displaying compassion and love for others. With autonomy, innocence can come as well, in this regard. The less an 8 fears being overpowered by others, which is the 8's basic fear, the easier it is to integrate, and to achieve the virtue of innocence.

    So I would say, since power was given to her fairly early in life, and she was able to retain it and nurture it and grow it on her own terms (first Drogo listened to her and gave her sway; then, she just took over entirely, with the aid of the dragons) ... she also could stay attached to those childhood dreams and live to enact them. Dreams of kindness, better treatment for women, taking back the kingdom that is hers by right, etc. 8s who are pursuing their goals will very likely have something "innocent" about them. Also, to contribute to this innocence, is the idea that each type is influenced by the two wings around it. Between the positive-outlook connections (9 on one side, 7 on the other, and a line to 2), 8 will have a lot of influence from positive outlook types which may contribute to a more innocent look in their eyes than people may expect from the stereotypes. The 9 side will give them peace and escapism; the 7 side will give them adventure and joy; the line to 2 will give them overwhelming love for others and joy of giving, as well as pride in themselves which brings joy. A healthy 8, who is subject to all these influences, in touch with their virtue of innocence, and integrated , will have this innocent quality that some people mentioned; even while still being powerful, and strong, and firm as leaders.
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  10. #50
    Blood of the Exile Animal's Avatar
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    ..... how is she not an 8? =p
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