What Type is Yoda?

[simulatedworld]

"Death is a natural part of life. Rejoice for those who transform into the Force. Mourn them do not. Miss them do not. Attachment leads to jealousy. The shadow of greed, that is." ―yoda

Okay, this one sounds kinda Ni because he's telling Luke to let go of the assumption that death is bad. Fair enough.

"Careful you must be when sensing the future, Anakin. The fear of loss is a path to the dark side." ―yoda

This sounds more Fi/Ne to me. "Look what will happen if you don't stay in touch with and in control of your emotions."

"Yes. A Jedi's strength flows from the Force. But beware the dark side. Anger, fear, aggression. The dark side of the Force are they. Easily they flow, quick to join you in a fight. If once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny." ―Yoda to Luke

Same as above; he's warning Luke to stay true to his feelings and avoid negative feelings that could send him down the wrong path. I don't see what's Ni about this.

these sound like traditional Ni wisdom if I understand correctly. Although there are also external connections Yoda makes in leaps (Ne). The force involves the ultimate connection and flow of all things, but it also enables hints of relations with processes and objects and the unfolding of events over time before they happen. The force also deals with visions and mental imagery, which is also pretty Ni. Although this does not make a force user more likely to use Ni than Ne and vice versa, it does accommodate the means of both. Overall the force is entirely N, but I'd say the concept appears very Ne, while the underlying uses and applications of the force would seem very Ni.

Well the force could be used by an Ni or Ne person, but the concept of the force itself seems pretty Ne (as you said.) I think the wisdom imparted above by Yoda, though, sounds a lot more Fi+Ne in nature.

The force itself doesn't seem to tell anyone what's going to happen--even the masters of the force, the top Jedi, were unable to detect an international conspiracy to overthrow the old Republic and create the empire. None of them were able to predict that Anakin would turn to the dark side.

And are you sure these visions and mental imagery are direct results of the force? It seems like they're mostly just the Ni of Ni-oriented people, regardless of whether or not the force is doing anything for them.

I would argue that the only people who apply the force in an Ni way are Ni users (like Obi-Wan) who are already predisposed to Ni means of perception.

 

[JoSunshine]

I think you guys are right that Yoda was an INFx...thanks for peeing all over my ENFJ parade.

 

[Quinlan]

How can the force be a Ne concept? Is gravity a Ne concept too?

 

[simulatedworld]

How can the force be a Ne concept? Is gravity a Ne concept too?

I'd call gravity more of an Se concept, but we're speaking kind of abstractly here. There's no way to be sure.

 

[JoSunshine]

I'd call gravity more of an Se concept, but we're speaking kind of abstractly here. There's no way to be sure.

Damn, that's^ funny.

 

[simulatedworld]

Well, gravity has an immediate and observable impact that's always felt in a directly physical way. That sounds kind of Se to me.

The force is a better metaphor for Ne because it's a kind of abstract interconnection between things in the outer world that isn't as concretely obvious.


P.S.,

My observation of these abstract relationships between unrelated contexts is in itself quite Ne. Make sense? ^_^

 

[Snuggletron]

This sounds more Fi/Ne to me. "Look what will happen if you don't stay in touch with and in control of your emotions."

I'll agree with the Fi behind it. Possibly Ne as well, but this quote seems like more of a foreboding revelation than just playing with connections seasoned with tasty grains of personal value.

Same as above; he's warning Luke to stay true to his feelings and avoid negative feelings that could send him down the wrong path. I don't see what's Ni about this.

Alright, that makes sense enough then.

Well the force could be used by an Ni or Ne person, but the concept of the force itself seems pretty Ne (as you said.) I think the wisdom imparted above by Yoda, though, sounds a lot more Fi+Ne in nature.

I'm pretty convinced Yoda is an Fi user as you've said his values go. His wisdom is able to make connections (Ne), but he is also able to reflect and produce obscure suggestions that can help predict unfolding events (Ni). He's a 900 year old Jedi though, is it fair enough to say both his intuitive functions are equally well developed?

The force itself doesn't seem to tell anyone what's going to happen--even the masters of the force, the top Jedi, were unable to detect an international conspiracy to overthrow the old Republic and create the empire. None of them were able to predict that Anakin would turn to the dark side.

yeah, the Force isn't exactly a cheat code (if it was the plot would've been incredibly shallow and there wouldn't have been war). However, the force offers mysterious and cryptic ways to help detect stirs within the network of the force.

And are you sure these visions and mental imagery are direct results of the force? It seems like they're mostly just the Ni of Ni-oriented people, regardless of whether or not the force is doing anything for them.

as mentioned above, the force provides the means to access visions and premonitions more readily. Think of it as a tap faucet for the intuitive functions. Not all Jedi were Ns, nor did they necessarily have to be intuitives to gain the benefit of it. In fact, you'd likely hone in on Se and Si to master the physical sensory effects of the force. All of the perceiving functions play a role on different levels (as it should be noted there were different roles for the jedi).

I would argue that the only people who apply the force in an Ni way are Ni users (like Obi-Wan) who are already predisposed to Ni means of perception.

I don't believe function use to be that exclusive. Although I'll say if they're already predisposed to Ni over Ne and vice versa, that is likely the first perceiving function they will use when tapping into the force. I think to effectively use the force in its entirety you'd need to utilize and develop both N functions (at some point)

 

[simulatedworld]

Well I won't turn this thread into another debate about it; suffice it to say I believe we only use four functions, so in my interpretation Yoda would have to be using either Ne or Ni, but not both.

Anyway your other points sound fine though.

 

[Snuggletron]

Well I won't turn this thread into another debate about it; suffice it to say I believe we only use four functions, so in my interpretation Yoda would have to be using either Ne or Ni, but not both.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding your view of the application of mbti/the functions, but I don't understand how this would work. Don't you use all of the functions? I'm no Se poster boy but I still need it to do a lot of activities and things.

I sort of view the 8 functions as being bars on a graph, but that's mainly because I don't believe anyone completely fits the function order of their type (as noted by many people's function order displays in their sigs).

 

[simulatedworld]

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but I don't understand how this would work. Don't you use all of the functions? I'm no Se poster boy but I still need it to do a lot of activities and things.

I sort of view the 8 functions as being bars on a graph, but that's mainly because I don't believe anyone completely fits the function order of their type (as noted by many people's function order displays in their sigs).

If you want to discuss this in PM or via wall posts, contact me on one of those.

 

[Snuggletron]

aye aye, forgot I was derailing the throd.

continue yoda talk

 

[bighairything]

I'm not really buying the ENFJ theory, but...

Also Jock, if I were a psychic who knew by a magical Force that the only way the universe could be saved was to desert myself on a swamp planet and wait for an obnoxious ISFJ, i'd STILL do it.

Kind of a no-brainer really.

Also, no way is the Force exclusively an Ni preserve. The Force is not type specific. The only thing that can be said with any certainty about the Force is that it hates SJs. And if it were type specific, I would associate it with Fi more strongly than I do with Ni.

Yoda's no INFP though. He's insufficiently intense. In fact, the more I think about it, the more convinced I am that yoda is a wise old ENFP. Just look at the way he's all over Luke's shit as soon as he turns up. How ENFP is that!

 

[BlueScreen]

. I'd so do the powerful jedi pretending to be stupid swamp creature thing. I probably wouldn't have as wise reason for it, more for amusement.

 

[bighairything]

. I'd so do the powerful jedi pretending to be stupid swamp creature thing. I probably wouldn't have as wise reason for it, more for amusement.

Wise reason? He was totally doing it for his own amusement!

ENFP stuck in a swamp for decades with no other sentient creatures around, of course the first thing he's going to want to do when someone turns up will be to play.

Then when it turns out the person who turned up is a whiny twat who's not interested in playing, he goes into a sulk and decides he can't teach him because he has no patience. This despite the fact he's been camped out in a swamp all these decades precisely in order to teach the whiny twat when he shows up, and the future of the galaxy depends on him doing so! Yeah, like that's such "oh-I'm-so-clued-up-about-destiny" Ni behaviour.

 

[TopherRed]

Which NF type is more likely to be an Extraverted actor (as Yoda screws with Luke)? ENFJ
Which NF type is more likely to try and boss you around? ENFJ
Which NF type spews *specific*wisdom from their pours concerning a *specific* situation as though it was vital to save the universe? ENFJ
Which NF type is most likely to pretend to be crippled, whilst acutally being able to kick your ass in 1,000 different pieces? ENFJ

INFPs are lovers, not fighters. They will more likely try to outwit their adversaries, rather than get into a saber fight.

Honestly guys, I'll go back and watch it again, but I'm relatively sure that Yoda is an ENFJ.

 

[JoSunshine]

Which NF type spews *specific*wisdom from their pours concerning a *specific* situation as though it was vital to save the universe? ENFJ

You mean kind of like arguing that Yoda was an ENFJ is of vital importance? I think you have proved your point.

 

[Stanton Moore]

Yoda is soooo INFP.


Ne:

“Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you; here, between you, me, the tree, the rock, everywhere, yes. Even between the land and the ship.”


He seems pretty constantly focused on explaining the interconnectedness of everything (Ne), and he spends a lot more time talking about personal feelings and emotions (his as well as others') than does the obviously INFJ Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan's insistence that his lie about Vader "murdering Luke's father" was true "from a certain point of view" is classic Ni--but Yoda doesn't mince words or sidestep problems this way. His ethical view is private, personal and deeply ingrained--seems like Fi to me. He's always directly informing Luke of the dangers associated with losing touch with his own emotions; that's so Fi!

I think Fi+Ne is pretty clear. Where are you guys getting Ni or Fe
Luke is pretty clearly ISFP.

Yoda seems pretty clearly to be a defender of the faith, so I think you may be onto something with INFP.

 

[simulatedworld]

Which NF type is more likely to be an Extraverted actor (as Yoda screws with Luke)? ENFJ
Which NF type is more likely to try and boss you around? ENFJ
Which NF type spews *specific*wisdom from their pours concerning a *specific* situation as though it was vital to save the universe? ENFJ
Which NF type is most likely to pretend to be crippled, whilst acutally being able to kick your ass in 1,000 different pieces? ENFJ

INFPs are lovers, not fighters. They will more likely try to outwit their adversaries, rather than get into a saber fight.

Honestly guys, I'll go back and watch it again, but I'm relatively sure that Yoda is an ENFJ.

You just picked several surface characteristics that you think represent ENFJs, then roundly dismissed INFP based on a grossly inaccurate generalization.

My INFP roommate has about eight semiautomatic firearms in his closet. INFPs can and will fight to the death to defend their ideals.

You haven't responded to any of the functional analysis that adoamros and I have discussed, but rather based your read on shallow surface characteristics and hasty generalizations with very little evidence.

I don't think watching Star Wars again is what you need to do--I think you need to read up on functional theory.


Just to humor you though--

1) Yoda never intentionally misleads Luke. He simply tries to expand Luke's perspective by explaining the interconnectedness of the universe in ways Luke has not yet realized. Ne

2) If you don't think INFPs will boss people around when something important to their values is at stake, look around this forum a little more closely.

3) I have no idea why you think "specific wisdom" concerning a "specific situation" is uniquely ENFJ. All types spew specific wisdom concerning specific situations, and if you were going to pick a type group that does this more often than others, it would not be an N type. It'd probably be an SJ.

4) I also have no idea why you think putting up a front of being crippled in order to disguise combat ability has anything to do with being ENFJ. This doesn't even seem type-related at all.

 

[Space_Oddity]

I don't know what type Yoda is, but I don't think an INFP is too likely. First and foremost he is a mentor, which doesn't really correlate with the INFP archetype. Sometimes they are the "behind the scenes" mentors, but active mentors? That's rare. I think this archetype is much more closely correlated to NFJs. INFPs are usually those undertaking a spiritual journey (like Luke) or they're a sort of moral figure/example who doesn't really have to do anything at all. ^^;;

 

[simulatedworld]

I never thought I'd say this, but you guys have some pretty boxed in ideas about INFPs.

I'm half expecting, "No way dude, I've never met an INFP with green skin. There's no way he can be one!"