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  1. #151
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    When I consider Yoda, I don't see a scientist, I see a wise counselor and a sage. INFJ.
    The "scientist" thing is just a cliché related to NT. You prove again that you don't anlyse the character in depth. You simply use stereotypes.
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    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  2. #152
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    The "math" thing is just a cliché. Elsewhere, Yoda is totally a thoughtful analyst and a detached philosopher. 'nuff said.
    Yoda's strengths, however, lie in the counseling business. Even in the prequels you will find him counseling others on a one-on-one basis. INFJ.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  3. #153
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    No, I am looking at the evidence of my own eyes. And those eyes see Yoda as a Sage and a Wise Counselor. INFJ.
    If you knew anything about MBTI, you knew that any type can be a "sage" and a "wise counselor", and that INFJ means preference for introversion rather than extroversion, intuition rather than sensing, feeling rather than thought and judgement rather than perception. But I proved that Yoda prefer thought and perception rather than feeling and judgement. Need I to quote myself again? Go back to school.
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

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    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  4. #154
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    No emiotion means no F. Peace is for the IP.
    Feeling does not equal emotion. Feeling is about ethic, and value-based judgment: what things mean to people. Maintaining calm and serenity does not mean the F functions are not involved in decision-making. And we can look at any impassioned INTP and see the reverse is true, as well. And all types can value peace. My ESFJ boyfriend is very much about peace - he is a 9w1, after all.

    There is no ignorance, there is knowledge
    So INTP.
    Since when have INTPs had a monopoly on knowledge? As far as I know, all people of all types can prize knowledge over ignorance. As an N-dominant I consider my own highest focus ideas and concepts, which I also consider knowledge, though perhaps a different sort than the INTP prizes.

    No passion means certainly no F. Serenity is IP.
    Again, passion is not monopolized by F types. Nor is calm and quiet monopolized by IPs. Passion may be utilized by F types in some decision-making but there is no necessity for that.

    Yoda is a 9w1.
    Yes, agreed.

    There is no death, there is the Force.
    There's nothing related to INFJ epecially in that.
    Actually, the change of frame of reference is very INxJ. It's a new way of looking at things. Death is not the usually-thought disappearance into nothing; it is instead synthesis with the Force.

    Yoda is a rude teacher who harshly tell the truth. He has low social skills. And if he is patient with you, when it's time to test you he will not take you by the hand, he will throw you in the water and you'll either sink or swim. He's clearly not a T, we just have to compare him with Luke or Padmé to see that. A crucial argument that the supporter of the INFJ theory avoid to face. He's even less emotional than Obi-Wan, who is a T.
    Just because he is less emotional does not make him a T. My ESFJ 9w1 boyfriend is far less emotional than my INTP 6w5 dad, who is regularly in some fiery state. I am not avoiding that argument; I am saying it is a logical fallacy. Feeling is not emotion. They are two totally separate concepts, though they can involve one another, and to believe they require one another is to have a very poor grasp on both concepts. The same holds true for believing that a "harsh" teacher could only be a T. I am a fan of sink-or-swim, too, and I am an F! If you have faith that the person can succeed - a typical NF sort of belief - then there is no cruelty in sink-or-swim, because you know that the person will be just fine. It's not about social skills at all, it's about the application of NF style humanistic growth to an individual. Your arguments here are rooted purely in stereotype.

    And yes, INTP are passive and detached anlysers. That's what Yoda is. But INFJs are not. They are chart-the-course, not behind-the-scene, they set projects, are organised and work hard toward them. Padmé, Shmi Skywalker, Dooku and Bail Organa are true INFJs. The difference with Yoda is very clear.
    Yoda is the leader of arguably the most powerful underground rebel organization in the galaxy working to stop the growing forces of the Dark Side and actively promoting peace and justice through the utilization of philosophical teachings combined with instructing quasi-martial art training and political diplomacy. That makes him primarily a passive and detached analyzer?

    If you were 900 years old you might step back and take a breath every now and then, too.

    And the whole "philosophy" thing doesn't prove anything. INTPs are philosophers too. But Yoda is not driven by emotional attachements and value judgments like INFJs are.
    Once again, Fe is not about emotional attachment. It is about interpersonal harmony. It is about understanding ties between things. Just like this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Yoda
    Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you; here, between you, me, the tree, the rock, everywhere, yes. Even between the land and the ship.

  5. #155
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    If you knew anything about MBTI,
    Oh I do!

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    you knew that any type can be a "sage" and a "wise counselor", and that INFJ means preference for introversion rather than extroversion, intuition rather than sensing, feeling rather than thought and judgement rather than perception. But I proved that Yoda prefer thought and perception rather than feeling and judgement. Need I to quote myself again? Go back to school.
    It doesn't matter what "any type can be," but what any type PREFERS to be in terms of that type's STRENGTHS. These are the defining features of type.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  6. #156
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    Yoda's strengths, however, lie in the counseling business. Even in the prequels you will find him counseling others on a one-on-one basis. INFJ.
    It's so much his strength, yes. We pretty much see that with Anakin.

    As I ever said, INTPs are often put in great considerations for their wise too, and searched for their counseling.

    MBTI is about preferences, not about your job. Anyway:

    You still refuse to fact the fact that Yoda is not emotional like true Feelers in the movie are. Luke, Padmé, Anakin, Chewbacca, are Feelers, Yoda is not one, the difference is clear and that aloe prove that yoda is not INFJ. Admit your wrong.
    This is an evidence that you refuse to face because it would force you to admit that you are wrong and you basically have a problem with that.
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

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    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  7. #157
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    Oh I do!



    It doesn't matter what "any type can be," but what any type PREFERS to be in terms of that type's STRENGTHS. These are the defining features of type.
    Yoda's preferences and forces are not for Feeling and Judgement, as I have ever explained.
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

    Chaotic Neutral

    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  8. #158
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    Just because he is less emotional does not make him a T. My ESFJ 9w1 boyfriend is far less emotional than my INTP 6w5 dad, who is regularly in some fiery state. I am not avoiding that argument; I am saying it is a logical fallacy. Feeling is not emotion. They are two totally separate concepts, and to believe they require one another is to have a very poor grasp on both concepts. The same holds true for believing that a "harsh" teacher could only be a T. I am a fan of sink-or-swim, too, and I am an F! If you have faith that the person can succeed - a typical NF sort of belief - then there is no cruelty in sink-or-swim, because you know that the person will be just fine.
    This is some good stuff. I particularly liked the part about NF being a faith sort of person. This plays a huge role in Empire where faith (belief) is required to lift Luke's ship from the swamp.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  9. #159
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    It's so much his strength, yes. We pretty much see that with Anakin.

    As I ever said, INTPs are often put in great considerations for their wise too, and searched for their counseling.

    MBTI is about preferences, not about your job. Anyway:
    Yoda is a Sage and a Wise Counselor. The point about faith made by Skylights is also huge.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  10. #160
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    Yoda's preferences and forces are not for Feeling and Judgement, as I have ever explained.
    You explained it, and Skylights knocked down your explanation.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

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