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  1. #11
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostwheel View Post
    A little nit to pick, if you please....

    I'm not sure we should conflate libertarian with objectivist.

    As far as I know, "objectivist" refers to Ayn Randism, but "libertarian" has a wide spectrum of meanings.

    Both Ron Paul ("right") and Noam Chomsky ("left") consider themselves libertarians. It's a very broad term, and hardly synchronous with objectivist.

    For example, I'd consider myself a Chomskian-style social libertarian, but by no means an objectivist-style anarcho-capitalist .

    Well, I know the term "libertarian" has a wide sense. I must be clear that when I use this word, I of course talk about people who sympathise with the idea of laissez-faire capitalism, limitation of goverment's prerogatives and personal freedom. So, Ron Paul is indeed a libertarian, but I'm not talking about people like you or Chomsky who, ultimately, are socialist for me. I'm also talking about objectivists since thay defand capitalistm and individuals freeedom too.

    By the way, many objectivists are not randist.
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  2. #12

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    Got to be honest there's only one of them so far that I dont think is a complete asshole.

  3. #13
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    It's confusing because the term "libertarians" initially designated every anarchists, without real distinctions. So, I guess Bakunin is sometimes called as "libertarian", but of course he's not by the current accepation of a defender of laissez-faire capitalism and individual freedoms.
    1. Originally "libertarian" always included socialist tenets. Socialist tenets. Now, some people call themselves "libertarians" who really mean by it radical capitalists. That's a more recent development.

    2. Bakunin was certainly an advocate of individual freedoms.

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    Proudhon was libertarian at the end of his life, and Spooner, Locke and Rand are, of course.
    Proudhon changed his mind about property (which made him different from the rest of the libertarian socialists), but he was never a capitalist, and never advocated private property in the capitalist meaning. He could certainly not be put in the same category as Rand.

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    I could easily agree with that, but when I said to a pal that Angie was objectivist, he answered me that Brad was objectivist even before her. Ironically, he's considered as the spiritual son of Rober Redford who is a liberal figurehead.
    Dude, if you look at Pitt's history of "activism," the only thing you could conclude is that he's a total socialist. If he's saying that he's some sort of right-wing libertarian now, then it's most likely because he's Angelina's bitch.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostwheel View Post
    A little nit to pick, if you please....

    I'm not sure we should conflate libertarian with objectivist.

    As far as I know, "objectivist" refers to Ayn Randism, but "libertarian" has a wide spectrum of meanings.

    Both Ron Paul ("right") and Noam Chomsky ("left") consider themselves libertarians. It's a very broad term, and hardly synchronous with objectivist.

    For example, I'd consider myself a Chomskian-style social libertarian, but by no means an objectivist-style anarcho-capitalist .
    Yes, exactly.
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  4. #14
    Senior Member ZPowers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    Dennis Leary ISTP 3w4



    Brad Pitt ISFP 7w6 So/Sx



    Lady Gaga ENFJ 6w7 Sx/So



    Matt Stone and Trey Parker, both ENTP



    Billie Joe Armstrong ENTP 7w6 So/Sx



    I'll post more later.
    The only political statements I can find for Leary are about liking Obama.

    Brad Pitt has only ever openly endorsed Dems and is part of a Going Green group (Jolie is more traditional libertarian, which makes sense since her father, Jon Voight, is pretty conservative)

    Lady Gaga: You're joking. Evidence?

    Trey and Matt may be, but they regularly express disgust for every political group and refuse to solidly place themselves anywhere in interviews. They've openly claimed "we are not on your side" in regards to most everyone. So that's halfway a shot in the dark. They seem to hate people's attitudes more than have strong stances on their beliefs or positions.

    Billie Jo Armstrong: Again, what evidence do you have? American Idiot is clearly liberal (I think he particpated in Rock Against Bush, and definitely supported Obama).
    Does he want a pillow for his head?

  5. #15
    libtard SJW chickpea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    Are you insinuating that her wealth give less accuracy to her opinions?
    i'm insinuating that her lack of ability to manage her own finances means she probably isn't an expert in economics.

    i don't even think half of these people are libertarians anyway so it doesn't really matter

  6. #16
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Yeah, where the hell does anyone get that Gaga is libertarian? The only issues she's even talked about are DADT, that Arizona immigration law, and gay marriage. If we went stereotypically, this would simply make her a run of the mill "liberal," but these are social issues and don't say anything one way or the other about her core political philosophy.
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  7. #17

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    Did anyone else notice that these people are ALL uber-rich celebrities?

  8. #18
    libtard SJW chickpea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Did anyone else notice that these people are ALL uber-rich celebrities?
    the only libertarians i know are either rich people who can afford to be libertarian, or young white males who spend too much time on the internet and not enough in reality.

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by chana View Post
    the only libertarians i know are either rich people who can afford to be libertarian, or young white males who spend too much time on the internet and not enough in reality.
    I concur, this is virtually science.

  10. #20
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    1. Originally "libertarian" always included socialist tenets. Socialist tenets. Now, some people call themselves "libertarians" who really mean by it radical capitalists. That's a more recent development.
    Capitalist libertarians are called libertarians by left-wing people themselves. And that's what we are talking about here. Not about Chomsky or other socialist shit. Capitalist libertarianism is a more recent and improved for of libertarianism.

    And only radicals peoples are coherent peoples.

    2. Bakunin was certainly an advocate of individual freedoms.
    Not really. He actually was an advocate of auto-gestion, wich is a very opressive concept. As a genral rule, the anarcho-socialist's defense of freedom is purely rethoric.


    Proudhon changed his mind about property (which made him different from the rest of the libertarian socialists), but he was never a capitalist, and never advocated private property in the capitalist meaning.
    Proudhon rejected capitalism in its institutionalised form, but thought that property right was an essential condition for freedom and a pillar of any decent social system, he rejected communism and was perfectly consistent with anarcho-capitalism.


    He could certainly not be put in the same category as Rand.
    No, but Rand is simply a sub-cateory of the whole pro-market
    libertarian category.

    Dude, if you look at Pitt's history of "activism," the only thing you could conclude is that he's a total socialist. If he's saying that he's some sort of right-wing libertarian now, then it's most likely because he's Angelina's bitch

    I can believe that since Brad Pitt always looked like a total idiot for me.
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    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

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