The ESFP "stupid" myth.

[Perch420]

Type is about personality preferences, not strengths and weaknesses. That is what what typology is about BY DEFINITION.

You're just juggling definitions around at this point. "Personality preferences" is the wrong word to use anyway; I don't "prefer" my personality, it's the way it is regardless of my opinion on the subject. ESFPs are incapable of abstract thinking by definition, therefore it is impossible for there to be an intelligent ESFP, period.

 

[lunalum]

I'm the one juggling definitions?

What source did you get that ESFP definition from?

 

[kyuuei]

^ The ever-so-reliable internet source. Of course, what they say isn't open to interpretation, and probably created by someone that was the smartest kid in their entire school, so you know it's legit.

I'm waiting for him to start the "Women have been scientifically proven to have smaller brains, so they can't be as smart as men!" and other stereotypical trolling speeches.

 

[Lex Talionis]

Dude, the few ESFPs I know can be unexpectedly intelligent underneath that facade they have going.
It's always kind of shocking to see it come off when they get serious. You'd think that someone that uppity and fun would be a total airhead.
Take for instance this supposedly stupid but beautiful/nice girl I know. She's got that... Stupid look. Plastic boobs, everything.
Anyway, gives the impression that she's really out there. Not a shred of intelligence in that head.
Took me a few years to get a glimpse of it, but this girl is actually an avid reader, politically interested and could discuss almost anything.
That's so INCREDIBLY sneaky. Almost like Claudius, pretending to be a fool for years.
Same for one of my best friends. He's so good at some stuff that it hurts.
Sure, not much of a scholar, more intelligent in that Barney fashion.

No, only one of the ESFPs I know is really fucking stupid less gifted.
To be honest, in proportion to that, I know more INTJs who are total reta... Less gifted.

What utter nonsense. Do you expect anybody to believe that you've met more intelligent ESFPs than INTJs? Don't make me laugh. According to what misguided interpretation of intelligence? An ENFJ's? Hah!

 

[Lex Talionis]

Here is a type description of the ESFP.



ESFPS are BY DEFINITION shallow thinkers. That's the DEFINITION of an ESFP, along with gregariousness and other things. That's their "con" just like an INTPs "con" is socialization. What's not to understand? "Intellectual" capacity, just like willpower, charisma, perceptive capacity, are all things that some personalities are good at and some bad at. Everyone has their strengths and weaknesses; for the ESFP it happens to be "deep" thinking and analysis, i.e. intelligence.

Thank you. A sensible thinker at last. I was beginning to believe that there weren't any here.

 

[Lex Talionis]

Type is about personality preferences, not strengths and weaknesses. That is what what typology is about BY DEFINITION.

Type is about the characteristics pertaining to a particular personality. Certain personalities are intrinsically stupid due to their interpretation of the world and the behavior utilized in interaction.

 

[Oaky]

Type is about the characteristics pertaining to a particular personality. Certain personalities are intrinsically stupid due to their interpretation of the world and the behavior utilized in interaction.

Does not mean they lack talent or ability to practice intelligence.

 

[Valiant]

What utter nonsense. Do you expect anybody to believe that you've met more intelligent ESFPs than INTJs? Don't make me laugh. According to what misguided interpretation of intelligence? An ENFJ's? Hah!

I think what you just said proves my point. You must be one of the more socially incompetent people I have ever met on here.
While it is improbable that you have sought professional help for your problem, I advise you to do so. Now, take that as a friendly recommendation.
This need to push down others can only be rooted in some form of deep insecurity, and to not get how others will react... Perhaps you have Asperger's syndrome.
I don't know you well enough to tell. But a high IQ and complete social unawareness are typical hallmarks for that.
Now, does that make you intelligent? I think not. It makes you unwholesome.
That was not too friendly, I suppose, but you really needed it.

I know your kind of guy, you'll just scoff at what I just said. You'll come up with something to justify your behavior and make me look bad.
What will be my victory over you is that everyone will continue to think you're an ass, and laugh at you... And perhaps, if you have some self-awareness, you'll feel some little twinge of doubt.

Just my five cents. ESFPs, at least, are pleasant to be around. What use are you if people would rather ingest pesticides than spend a minute near you?

 

[Lex Talionis]

Does not mean they lack talent or ability to practice intelligence.

One cannot "practice" intelligence. Either one is or is not intelligent. There is no middle ground.

 

[Lex Talionis]

I think what you just said proves my point. You must be one of the more socially incompetent people I have ever met on here.
While it is improbable that you have sought professional help for your problem, I advise you to do so. Now, take that as a friendly recommendation.
This need to push down others can only be rooted in some form of deep insecurity, and to not get how others will react... Perhaps you have Asperger's syndrome.
I don't know you well enough to tell. But a high IQ and complete social unawareness are typical hallmarks for that.
Now, does that make you intelligent? I think not. It makes you unwholesome.
That was not too friendly, I suppose, but you really needed it.

I know your kind of guy, you'll just scoff at what I just said. You'll come up with something to justify your behavior and make me look bad.
What will be my victory over you is that everyone will continue to think you're an ass, and laugh at you... And perhaps, if you have some self-awareness, you'll feel some little twinge of doubt.

Just my five cents. ESFPs, at least, are pleasant to be around. What use are you if people would rather ingest pesticides than spend a minute near you?

I don't know what to make of this. Not only is this irrelevant, but it is also hopelessly one dimensional (and wrong), particularly from an ENFJesque perspective.

 

[Valiant]

The "not relevant" card. How very typical.
It only means that whatever I tried to say is beyond your supposedly intuitive and superior comprehension.

 

[Oaky]

One cannot "practice" intelligence. Either one is or is not intelligent. There is no middle ground.

This translates into intelligence makes a personality type. It's not a credible assumption. It would imply that the higher state of critical thinking ability makes one more prone to acting a certain way in difference to their natural states. The practices and general thoughts of INT types tend to fall towards intellectual challenge and so they start to strengthen their intellect. But then you imply that that an ESFP who decides to stand out from their natural projection and practices the same practices an INT would, would not be able to reach their level or higher. This, you absolutely have no fact to back up nor can you depend on any generalisation or statistics to prove against. And so again, the assumption is not credible .

 

[King sns]

Here is a type description of the ESFP.



ESFPS are BY DEFINITION shallow thinkers. That's the DEFINITION of an ESFP, along with gregariousness and other things. That's their "con" just like an INTPs "con" is socialization. What's not to understand? "Intellectual" capacity, just like willpower, charisma, perceptive capacity, are all things that some personalities are good at and some bad at. Everyone has their strengths and weaknesses; for the ESFP it happens to be "deep" thinking and analysis, i.e. intelligence.

The description you posted states that ESFP's tend to avoid theoretical thinking, and don't like classroom learning which says nothing about inborn intellectual ability. The IQ test that a lot of people here tend to refer to is about ability to learn, adjust to different scenarios and problems, and have the ability to solve those problems. There's no "deep" philosophical thinking involved, only quick and simple problem solving. So, one can be a stereotypical ESFP- someone who hates school, scoffs at the idea of opening a philosophy or physics book, and just wants to just go to the beach all day long and still have those adjusting and problem solving abilities (greater than that of any stereotypical INTJ,). Smart ESFP's can dance cicles around schools, never show up for class, spend all night partying and still get straight A's.(Because if you're intelligent, you've probably found out how to do so. ) It's not an ESFP's perogative to hang around with books, they want to be around people and excitement. That's what the description is saying. You can keep your nose in a book all day but inborn intelligence is inborn intelligence, it's not changing. "ESFP's don't like to theorize so they are dumb" is just a wall to hide behind so that some of you can say... "Well I like to theorize! I like going to class. That's something I can do all day to avoid life experience. That must make me smart, unlike an ESFP." Think again. I'd like to see half of you sitting next to my empty seat in class, (or doodling and snoozing self) and take bets about who's going to get the better grade. I'm pretty sure that most of my former classmates would have still put their money on me.

ESFP's hate school, books, and theorizing. Intelligence is a whole other thing.

 

[miss fortune]

the supposedly smart people are making a VERY naive argument there... why on earth would you trust people that much?

and why would you think that ability = interest? I was GOOD at business calc but I'm sure as hell NOT making a career out of it

 

[Litvyak]

Are all ESFPs stupid? No.
By the same token, an INTP cannot be "stupid" in the traditional sense.

So ESFPs can be intelligent by definition, yet it's impossible for an INTP to be stupid "by the same token" ?
Besides of being incredibly shortsighted, your logical and reasoning ability sucks. Such non sequiturs aren't very appealing in an ESFP bash.

 

[King sns]

So ESFPs can be intelligent by definition, yet it's impossible for an INTP to be stupid "by the same token" ?
Besides of being incredibly shortsighted, your logical and reasoning ability sucks. Such non sequiturs aren't very appealing in an ESFP bash.

This thread kind of reminds me of a philosophy class I took once... (Had to) A whole bunch of people really really into the class, reading every detail and note of every book and leaving their hands raised constantly. (Not to say anything of their intelligence, they just found it interesting, which is fine.) However, I'm sitting there skimming the book, reading a few pages of every chapter... Come test time I'm getting the A+ and the comments "I'm going to make an example of your test! Your thought process is amazing! How did you come up with this??" (They were essay/free writing tests.) While other people were pouting and going "That test was so hard. I got a C." THAT is problem solving, making connections, and adjusting to situations on my part. (Especially for someone who hates the topic and never wants to see those books ever again.)

I don't normally come on here to brag about how smart I am, but this thread.... is. ridiculous. I will tell the stories if it helps my point. COME ON PEOPLE!! Meet some smart ESFP's and GET it already! It has NOTHING to do with personality type. You'll have to find yourself another quality to hide behind. Go start a thread that says, "ESFP's suck at strategic planning and war." I'll give that one to you. You can have that one. Don't make me break out anymore stories.

 

[King sns]

I am eagerly awaiting rebuttal on these posts. Please not: "Then you're probably an ENFP", or- "you're lying." OR, "then you're different from all the other ESFPs"... All of the above unacceptable answers.

 

[Speed Gavroche]

Perch and Lex: INTx stupid myth.

Oh, by the way, INTPs invented atomic bombs.
ESFPs invented Funk, Heavy Metal and Rock'n Roll.
Wich type is the most inteligent then?

 

[King sns]

Actually, this thread is rather flattering. Some people clearly want natural intelligence and try to get it any way they can. You guys have no way of knowing this, but being born smarter is just like being born with blue eyes or brown hair. You don't go around talking about it or even thinking about it unless somebody brings it up. Let me explain this in the theoretical and metaphorical language that you guys speak.

I feel like I have brown hair sitting with some blondes and redheads who are saying.. "I have brown hair. My hair is browner!" Seriously, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. But then when those people with different colored hair turn to me and say, "You can't possibly have brown hair, because you have blue eyes. It just doesn't work that way, unfortunate little you." And then continue on and on and on and on. Eventually, I'm going to pipe up and say, "You guys are ludacris! Brown hair has nothing to do with eye color!!"

 

[ISFPeaceOut]

Actually, this thread is rather flattering. Some people clearly want natural intelligence and try to get it any way they can. You guys have no way of knowing this, but being born smarter is just like being born with blue eyes or brown hair. You don't go around talking about it or even thinking about it unless somebody brings it up. Let me explain this in the theoretical and metaphorical language that you guys speak.

I feel like I have brown hair sitting with some blondes and redheads who are saying.. "I have brown hair. My hair is browner!" Seriously, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. But then when those people with different colored hair turn to me and say, "You can't possibly have brown hair, because you have blue eyes. It just doesn't work that way, unfortunate little you." And then continue on and on and on and on. Eventually, I'm going to pipe up and say, "You guys are ludacris! Brown hair has nothing to do with eye color!!"

this^. btw i just found out im an esfp, not isfp, and im actually attending college right now on an entirely academic scholarship. back when i was a computer science major (i switched because it was too boring) i used to consistently get the highest grades in my class and i skipped school all the time. i almost became a math major because its my best subject, but decided not to because my math classes were becoming so theoretical that i, once again, got bored with it. now i'm thinking of doing something in the medical field

normally i wouldn't ever make a post like this either because talking about how smart you are is arrogant and ridiculous, but so is this thread, so i thought i'd chime in and support my smart esfp brethren.