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  1. #191
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    Actually ESFPs are some of the smarter types from what I've noticed. Probably Se and Te working together.
    A hero is someone who does the right thing without expectation of reward, just because it's the right thing to do.

  2. #192
    Senior Member Lex Talionis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    You're right. It's pretty much pointless, since the entire point of trying to say that any type is stupid, (or otherwise inadequate) to begin with is to make themselves feel better about their own abilities.
    This is a complete bare assertion. You are making an illogical leap in thinking that I must have ulterior motives for what I do. Yet you claim that I am illogical? Your entire stance is based on unscientific supposition.

    It's difficult to make valid arguments against people who are debating using facts and evidence that came from the debris that's flowing from their ass.
    What facts and evidence that come "flowing from their ass"? It's a simple matter of disproving my assertions.

    And well, honestly, when you're intelligent, you're intelligent. When you're not, you're not. And there's not much that anyone can say or do to change that.
    That isn't the argument. The argument is that ESFPs generally exhibit behavior which is generally considered "stupid." Whether or not their core intelligence (which I wouldn't define as ultimate intelligence) is adept or not is a different matter. The very fact that they do what they do and think the way they think is a sign of weak reasoning and poor critical thinking.

    You are only strengthening my argument when you type this kind of nonsense.
    "Death is nothing, but to live defeated and inglorious is to die daily."
    —Bonaparte

  3. #193
    Senior Member Lex Talionis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    Agree. Definitely ENP. Although I've been questioning the F recently.
    No he isn't. He's definitely an S. Where do you get the idea that he's an N?

    What I see all too often on this forum is that people point out one or two traits which are insignificant and suppose that one is of a particular temperament.

    Peter Griffin exhibits no clear signs of being an intuit. He is a typical jester who acts purely on immediate grounds and impulses.

    Stewie and Brian are definitely NTs, and Meg is most likely an NF, but Peter is definitely an S. Lois is probably an NF as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by LotsOfHeart View Post
    Actually ESFPs are some of the smarter types from what I've noticed. Probably Se and Te working together.
    Prove it. Se and Te working together to produce what? Where is the depth of intelligence in that? Se and Te would work if one had as many variables as possible, but that is hardly indicative of intelligence, which works on inference and deduction to come up with rational explanations. It is effective when it comes to logically organizing, but not planning, abstract reasoning, and concept building.
    "Death is nothing, but to live defeated and inglorious is to die daily."
    —Bonaparte

  4. #194
    Rainy Day Woman MDP2525's Avatar
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    ESFP's are quintessential jokers. I've seen them do things just for the effect it has on their "audience" Make them laugh or whatever. One of my best friends is an ESFP and I've seen her purposely walk into walls for the effect. She never lets on that she's doing these kinds of things on purpose and she's so good at it that if you didn't know her, you'd think she was being serious. LOL.

    So I could see how the "stupid" myth can be generated but it's just them playing the fool. They are very smart interpersonally.
    ~luck favors the ready~


    Shameless Self-Promotion:MDP2525's Den and the Start of Motorcycle Maintenance

  5. #195
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Talionis View Post
    What facts and evidence that come "flowing from their ass"? It's a simple matter of disproving my assertions.
    We have been, constantly, in this thread. But you don't seem to get that. We say that you can't generalize like that, and yet you continue to assert that you can and that it's 100% accurate every time.

    Seriously, stop bullshitting. What is there to gain, to force these bullshit assertions into this thread? Everything you're posting here lacks purpose and you CANNOT prove that every ESFP is like what you've described based on a few people you've met. This is a basic rule in science, in any form of study, a basic guideline. That correlations aren't set in stone, ever. Statistical significance, in your case a few ESFPs, does NOT make a set standard. This is dangerous thinking in any field of study. This is like saying that because you win at a slot machine three times in a row, that you will win every time.

    If you've been to college or taken any psychological courses in your entire life, it's in the second chapter of your textbook. Read the section about experimenting. If you've taken any formal psychology classes then you will know that what you're asserting is bullshit just because the statistical significance is nil. You are obviously un educated if you are asserting these claims.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Talionis View Post
    Prove it.
    Disprove it.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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  6. #196
    Senior Member Lex Talionis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    We have been, constantly, in this thread. But you don't seem to get that. We say that you can't generalize like that, and yet you continue to assert that you can and that it's 100% accurate every time.

    Seriously, stop bullshitting. What is there to gain, to force these bullshit assertions into this thread? Everything you're posting here lacks purpose and you CANNOT prove that every ESFP is like what you've described based on a few people you've met. This is a basic rule in science, in any form of study, a basic guideline. That correlations aren't set in stone, ever. Statistical significance, in your case a few ESFPs, does NOT make a set standard. This is dangerous thinking in any field of study. This is like saying that because you win at a slot machine three times in a row, that you will win every time.

    If you've been to college or taken any psychological courses in your entire life, it's in the second chapter of your textbook. Read the section about experimenting. If you've taken any formal psychology classes then you will know that what you're asserting is bullshit just because the statistical significance is nil. You are obviously un educated if you are asserting these claims.
    I'm not generalizing. I'm making a simple point as to the character of ESFPs.

    If an ESFP is "smart," it is because they were able to develop other strengths such as intuitive insight and abstract reasoning.

    What's so difficult to understand about this? I don't have an agenda, and it does matter, because truth ultimately matters.

    Disprove it.
    What kind of response is that?
    "Death is nothing, but to live defeated and inglorious is to die daily."
    —Bonaparte

  7. #197
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    Couldn't many ESFPs just be naturally smart? Furthermore, it is more likely that the naturally smart ESFPs developed other functions because of their innate intelligence which, in turn, furthers their mental capabilities even more. As a result, the intelligence of an ESFP is not dependent on developing N but most likely the cause of developing N (and other functions). The same thing could be said for any other other type. For example, I can't see how a smart ENFJ who just heavily relies on FeNi is smarter than someone who has developed SeTi also.
    Last edited by Glycerine; 10-11-2009 at 11:10 AM.

  8. #198
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Talionis View Post
    I'm not generalizing. I'm making a simple point as to the character of ESFPs.

    If an ESFP is "smart," it is because they were able to develop other strengths such as intuitive insight and abstract reasoning.

    What's so difficult to understand about this? I don't have an agenda, and it does matter, because truth ultimately matters.
    Making a "simple point as to the character of ESFPs" IS a generalization. How is it not?

    So you think that "smart" is essentially NT characteristics?

    Wow. All that I have to say is that you are gravely misusing this system.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Talionis View Post
    What kind of response is that?
    If you ask for someone to prove themselves in a rhetorical style, it's pretty safe to assume that you can easily disprove it and you have disproved it in your mind.

    And you still can't prove that anything you say is true.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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  9. #199
    half-nut member briochick's Avatar
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    of most (not all) the ESFPs I've known, few were willing to engage in "all that smart stuff." A couple examples; My sister probably has a moderate IQ but, by God, you'd think she'd been raised by the mentally debilitated for how much of her brain matter she actually *uses*. My ESFP just generally assumes that book smarts, or practical smarts, or logical stuff, or analytical stuff isn't for her, but she graduated with a better gpa than I did. It can get frustrating. Though both of them are way better at pleasing people and getting what they want than I am.
    I don't think actual skill has much to do with it, but rather an unwillingness to live outside the moment.
    Last edited by briochick; 10-10-2009 at 10:48 PM. Reason: t
    -Brio

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  10. #200
    Senior Member Silly_Siren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Talionis View Post
    If an ESFP is "smart," it is because they were able to develop other strengths such as intuitive insight and abstract reasoning.
    I thought S stood for sensing, not stupid. Are ballerinas, musicians, sculptors innately stupid just because they aren't big on NT?

    I'd scratch my head again, but this thread has already made my scalp raw.
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