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  1. #11
    Senior Member Noon's Avatar
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    I forgot how she was in The Bad Beginning, but it could be that the circumstances have caused her to appear more extroverted as the series progressed. All of the children are forced to step far outside of their comfort zones in each book. I also think that she feels compelled to step in for her parents simply because she is the eldest, as well.

    I can see INTJ to a certain extent. She is indeed reserved, with amazing focus that enables her to quickly sort through her ideas to find what is most useful. She also does seem to be more CtC than GtG and spends an equal amount of time implementing her ideas as she does contemplating them. With inferior Se, however, would an INTJ be so attentive to their environment? I can't really imagine it (being inferior Se) and what it's like, so I'm only guessing. Maybe it's that her development is speeding up because of the stress. Inferior Se would explain why she overlooks small details that Klaus can dive in to.

    Quote Originally Posted by mrsherlockholmes View Post
    But why is that an extroverted trait? If anything, introverts are more likely to be shy, reserved and not want trouble if they can avoid it.
    Is not an extroverted trait, but in my opinion a trait that would clash with dominant Ti/inferior Fe. Because ETPs have tertiary Fe, they are often more charming and sociable than ITPs, but I don't know how much more tactful or polite they would be, only that it seems logically feasible for them to be so.

    I hated the film version. The comedic factor made it more appealing to the targeted audience, but it ruined the series and Olaf's character for me. Blech.

    I think Olaf seems more In Charge than CtC.

    edit: Maybe Violet is INFJ. She does not possess the bluntness of Te and is always described as charming.

  2. #12
    Consulting Detective Mr. Sherlock Holmes's Avatar
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    What's CtC? Also, if Violet was INTJ, do you think the Fi would explain her politeness? But then again, Klaus is probably an INTP, and he's also polite. I dunno, politeness is a hard thing to type. They do sometimes speak out when they have good reason, but are usually silenced quickly. I have an INTP friend who is rather polite, so... yeah, it's difficult to type politeness I think.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Noon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrsherlockholmes View Post
    What's CtC? Also, if Violet was INTJ, do you think the Fi would explain her politeness? But then again, Klaus is probably an INTP, and he's also polite. I dunno, politeness is a hard thing to type. They do sometimes speak out when they have good reason, but are usually silenced quickly. I have an INTP friend who is rather polite, so... yeah, it's difficult to type politeness I think.
    Fi is really empathetic, but not always polite. I think that Fi in the INTJ contributes to their skill for tuning other [less useful] opinions out, if anything. It's difficult to sway an INTJ from his/her purpose.

    CtC (chart-the-course) is one of the four interaction styles. They're explained in this thread.

  4. #14
    Consulting Detective Mr. Sherlock Holmes's Avatar
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    I can't decide based on that whether Olaf is more IC or CtC. He does a lot of plotting by himself and in the second book he sat and waited all night waiting in case the Baudelaires tried to mess with the plan, which is pretty CtC, though he often uses methods of manipulation as part of his plans, improvising with stories and communication, which seems more IC. I think.

    Also, I think that the fact that I saw the movie before I read the books made it much easier to enjoy it because I wasn't worrying about them being similar. I actually really enjoyed it as a comedic and artistic movie. It wasn't a terribly faithful adaption in many respects, but it was certainly very enjoyable.

  5. #15
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    What do you think of Snicket himself and how he is written as a behind the scenes character? I think you could probably tell from his writing style and allusions to his personality and history throughout the book.

  6. #16
    Senior Member Noon's Avatar
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    I get In Charge based on his behavior with his troupe and other associates. He's extremely directive and initiating, results oriented, and likes moves to be made with maximum efficiency (he is incredibly frustrated with the careless mistakes of others). He doesn't really care about keeping the team on track. He cares more about doing whatever it takes to realize his plan. I could never see him as a follower or team worker, to be honest. He always has the need to be leader (he does not like being challenged or disobeyed).

    Because of dominant Te/inferior Fi, he has no problem at all with stepping on thousands of toes in order to carry out his plans. When really, really invested, he can nearly overlook the humanity of his troupe and think of them merely as tools. When trying to weasel his way into the childrens' lives, he always appears charming and 'good-intentioned' to the adults, but that is not his true self. He always regresses to his true self sooner or later.

    I think he also has a more commanding presence than an INTJ would, and certainly more control over/impact onto his environment. Retreat into improvisation and brute force when his first plan fails is due to tertiary Se. I think how he does it in some books is a good example of tertiary temptation.

    Perhaps it's only a bit relevant, but I think it's typical for writers to choose ENTJ as their villain archetype.

  7. #17
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    The most common villain archetype actually seems to be INTJ I think, followed by ENTJ, ESTJ, ENTP and then maybe some Fs. I wonder if there are ever any ISFP villains though. I think they seem least likely.

  8. #18
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    Here's a challenge. Count Olaf's theatre troupe.

    Hook-handed man (Fernald):
    Bald man
    White-powder-faced women (they're the same aren't they?):
    Person of indeterminate gender: ISTJ

    That last one is the only one I can think of/remember. He/she's just like a robotic drone.

  9. #19
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    Just been reading the 4th book. I'm really unsure about these ones atm.

    Sir seems to have the commanding air of an ESTJ (I think he's a defo STJ) but he doesn't seem overly social, so maybe ISTJ.

    Phil seems to be an ESFJ I think.

    Charles is probably an ISFP. He does seem a bit idealistic at times, despite being totally unwilling to stand up for himself, so maybe N. Would also fit with his strong desire for a library.
    JiNe
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    "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

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  10. #20
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    Okay, read the second half. Dr Orwell seems ENTJ. Sir is an asshole.

    I didn't like the ending to this one. It was too farfetched. I know these books do stretch the boundaries of realism, but a baby defending against a sword with teeth? And gum being long and strong enough to pull a log back but not massive enough to be thrown towards the machine? My favourite book on rereading so far has been the Wide Window.
    JiNe
    Ti | Fi | Ne | Si | Te | Ni | Fe | Se
    Enneagram: 5w4 sx/sp

    "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

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