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INTJ "Intelligent" Myth

Oaky

Travelling mind
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Jan 15, 2009
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6,180
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INTJ
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5w6
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sp/so
INTs are closest to the word INTelligent. Coincidence? Yes... it is. The stereotype of INTJ intellect would have derived from the obsessive nature of many INTJs trying to prove they are smarter than everyone else. A type obsessed with intellect and that is why they are associated with it. It does not however mean they have it.
 

PeaceBaby

reborn
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Jan 7, 2009
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INTs are closest to the word INTelligent. Coincidence? Yes... it is. The stereotype of INTJ intellect would have derived from the obsessive nature of many INTJs trying to prove they are smarter than everyone else. A type obsessed with intellect and that is why they are associated with it. It does not however mean they have it.

Well expressed, and insightful.
 

Valiant

Courage is immortality
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Jul 7, 2007
Messages
3,895
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ENTJ
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8w7
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sx/so
INTs are closest to the word INTelligent. Coincidence? Yes... it is. The stereotype of INTJ intellect would have derived from the obsessive nature of many INTJs trying to prove they are smarter than everyone else. A type obsessed with intellect and that is why they are associated with it. It does not however mean they have it.

I agree, and would like to add that a type obsessed with it would more likely than not be trying to improve upon things most of the time, or at least often.
Not saying one would have to be an INTJ to be intelligent or insightful, though, that'd be stupid.

All MBTI types have assigned roles, sort of. The INTJ one is given.
We amass and process knowledge. Some are genuinely retarded, though.
I know quite a few "INTJs" with disorders and others who are just plain rude/unpleasant.
Some i've seen, on here in particular, fall into the anti-social category.
I'd say that the chance of failure during construction of an INTJ is high... Well, any NT type, to be honest.

But, in the cases where the INTJ isn't a completely flawed construction, things might work out well and you get an individual who will be a lifelong active learner.
As for myself, I know I have my flaws. Temper, gluttony, competitiveness...
But, I am overcoming them and evolving, gradually.
 

stillwater

New member
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
7
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INTJ
I think my big question about this type of argument is why are INTx's always robbed of their "thing" so to speak, their mode of being? Everybody seems to want a piece of the intelligence pie to claim as their own, but they won't give up the piece of pie already on their plate. The idea really isn’t farfetched that a preference for a pervasive manner of viewing and understanding the world framed through thought and analysis would lead to ability in those areas. I would hope all types are good at the mode in which the most commonly approach life. But what is farfetched is the idea that someone who had processed most of their life this way would suck at it. There seems to be something in the word intelligence that brings out the worst greed in people. People want to claim it for their own or tarnish it so it’s not worth as much. How often does the debate turn into how intelligence or intellect is defined and whether or not the tests based off of the definitions are biased towards certain groups? People know intelligence in real life when they encounter it. Just like they know a genuinely kind soul or someone with great humor, but there is a different premium put on the word intelligence that seems to damn any conversation that makes mention of it.

Essentially, no one wants to say that they’re not intelligent. The problem is in the word. People will admit to being poor at relationships, chronically clumsy, easily emotionally distressed, easily distracted, bad at art and even not creative—but no one wants to be called stupid. If there was a way to express the mental processing that NT’s do without invoking the connotations that tinge every discussion of it that would be great. But at present there isn’t. There is an incompatibility of terminology that may be superficial or it may be pervasive in its reach, but until the language changes the debate and arguments will rage. But for the record, whatever NT’s have should not be claimed or found meritless by someone else at a whim. It took a lot of time to develop that (for which many of the experiences were unpleasant). Likewise, the same can be said for the mental processes of the other types and groupings. It is somewhat insulting to say that it's a lie that someone is good at what they've practiced their whole life--it negates what they feel they can offer others.
 

Edgar

Nerd King Usurper
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
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sx
I've noticed a trend in television sitcoms for "intelligent" characters to be INTJs.
Notably, Stewy Griffin, Gandalf the Grey, Hannibal Lectar and Severus Snape.

Obviously this a stereotype unfounded in reality, but what is it about INTJs that makes Hollywood writers make them intelligent characters, or alternatively make intelligent characters into INTJs?

Gandalf always seemed more of an NTP to me, but anyway, you are missing a part of the equation. INTJs are not just portrayed as intelligent, they are portrayed as intelligent villains.

INTJ personality is a perfect villain character for a story line - secretive, calculating, determined, and unaffected by societal morality.
 

Edgar

Nerd King Usurper
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sx
Well I think Stewie is an ENTP, but that's beside the point, I guess.

Stewie started off as an INTJ, but then the show writers started to get lazy so they just turned him into a one joke, flamboyant queer (i.e. more ExxP).
 

Jaguar

Active member
Joined
May 5, 2007
Messages
20,647
The idea really isn’t farfetched that a preference for a pervasive manner of viewing and understanding the world framed through thought and analysis would lead to ability in those areas.

Preference for X, has no correlation with skill or ability.

But what is farfetched is the idea that someone who had processed most of their life this way would suck at it.

There's nothing far-fetched about it, whatsoever.
Just because someone "sings" their whole life, doesn't mean they can sing well at all.
They could sing so poorly, family members are forced to place their hands over their ears.
 

miss fortune

not to be trusted
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so stillwater gets his feelings hurt if his "pet ability" as an INTJ is used by others? :horor:

I guess I'd better start getting pissed off when other types are good athletes then :rolleyes:
 

miss fortune

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or grow algae :doh:

but whining is the major ability shown so far :devil:

and if it makes him feel any better at least I phrase smart things in a dumb way (i.e. "dude, you're getting it all wrong! If you'd added that space between the numbers there when you were typing them in...") :)
 

simulatedworld

Freshman Member
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Nov 7, 2008
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ENTP
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The interesting statistic is not the number but the proportion.

If we go by this page, Meyers-Briggs Statistics
there's way more female ENFP than any other female type. Proportionately, I'd imagine the female INTJ is quite possibly on top as well. Do you know where I can find this data? All I could find with a bit of googling is that 83% of national merit finalists are N and that there are disproportionately many I's as well.

Also, about the INTJ is smart stereotype, every statistical measure I have seen suggests it is true (35% chance of being in the top 2% of IQ is pretty striking, for example). (Ugh, this post would seem a hell of a lot less self congratulatory back when I self-identified as INTP.)

How about a little of that famous Ni here, guys? :doh:

Let's think for a moment about what it is that IQ tests actually test. Your assertions are predicated on the erroneous assumption that IQ tests provide an accurate assessment of all forms of intelligence.

In fact, they don't. They test iNtuitive-Thinking intelligence, which explains why NT types tend to do better on them.

In fact, there are many kinds of intelligence. Se intelligence, for instance, simply doesn't tend to lead people toward applying for things like the National Merit Scholarship.

Everyone in this thread citing such statistics is missing the point: that there is more than one form of intelligence, and that scoring higher on tests of NT-type intelligence doesn't prove anything about intelligence as a whole.

If you guys want to show that you're smarter than everyone you need to do a little better than showing that you do well on tests of your own kind of intelligence. If we designed a test of emotional intelligence, FPs would crush you. It's arrogant and short-sighted to assume that your kind of intelligence is "THE intelligence."
 

Zarathustra

Let Go Of Your Team
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
Messages
8,110
I think my big question about this type of argument is why are INTx's always robbed of their "thing" so to speak, their mode of being? Everybody seems to want a piece of the intelligence pie to claim as their own, but they won't give up the piece of pie already on their plate. The idea really isn’t farfetched that a preference for a pervasive manner of viewing and understanding the world framed through thought and analysis would lead to ability in those areas. I would hope all types are good at the mode in which the most commonly approach life. But what is farfetched is the idea that someone who had processed most of their life this way would suck at it. There seems to be something in the word intelligence that brings out the worst greed in people. People want to claim it for their own or tarnish it so it’s not worth as much. How often does the debate turn into how intelligence or intellect is defined and whether or not the tests based off of the definitions are biased towards certain groups? People know intelligence in real life when they encounter it. Just like they know a genuinely kind soul or someone with great humor, but there is a different premium put on the word intelligence that seems to damn any conversation that makes mention of it.

Essentially, no one wants to say that they’re not intelligent. The problem is in the word. People will admit to being poor at relationships, chronically clumsy, easily emotionally distressed, easily distracted, bad at art and even not creative—but no one wants to be called stupid. If there was a way to express the mental processing that NT’s do without invoking the connotations that tinge every discussion of it that would be great. But at present there isn’t. There is an incompatibility of terminology that may be superficial or it may be pervasive in its reach, but until the language changes the debate and arguments will rage. But for the record, whatever NT’s have should not be claimed or found meritless by someone else at a whim. It took a lot of time to develop that (for which many of the experiences were unpleasant). Likewise, the same can be said for the mental processes of the other types and groupings. It is somewhat insulting to say that it's a lie that someone is good at what they've practiced their whole life--it negates what they feel they can offer others.

See!

INTJs ARE more intelligent than everybody else!
 

Spamtar

Ghost Monkey Soul
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I think you all might be treating stillwater a little unfairly. Motivation is a powerful factor as far as intelligence or the perception of being intelligent, well read or wise. Similarly singing (although there are some people who should give up because of their voice or being tone deaf) is generally improved with motivation which leads practice which leads to perfect or near perfect (similar to tuning caring for and practicing an instrument).
 

miss fortune

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^ my mom studies multiple intelligences and related learning strategies for her masters :)

I remember reading quite a bit about the bias in IQ test in stats AND social psych- the test is definitley biased towards one way of thinking, which is why minorities and women usually tend to score lower, even though they aren't less intelligent than white males :rolli:
 

simulatedworld

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^ I love how the INTJs keep showing up insisting that they're the smartest because xyz study shows that they do the best in [x competition of NT intelligence]...as if that's somehow relevant to the overall picture intelligence in all its different forms.
 

Loxias

New member
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Mar 10, 2010
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INxj
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So, what defines non-male/white intelligence. What are its outcomes according to that, what to expect from it?
 

Zarathustra

Let Go Of Your Team
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
Messages
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^ my mom studies multiple intelligences and related learning strategies for her masters :)

I remember reading quite a bit about the bias in IQ test in stats AND social psych- the test is definitley biased towards one way of thinking, which is why minorities and women usually tend to score lower, even though they aren't less intelligent than white males :rolli:

The fact of the matter is that while there are different kinds of intelligences, certain kinds of intelligence help you "get ahead" in the world more than others.

That's the type of intelligence that's generally measured in standardized tests (although emotional intelligence isn't, and that certainly helps you get ahead, especially when combined with the intelligence that is tested by standardized tests).
 

miss fortune

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and you're definitley forgetting interpersonal intelligence, and I really don't see many poor professional athletes or movie stars running around :rolli:

some weird INTJs keep wandering around flaunting their inferiority complexes by trying to find SOMETHING that they're better than anyone else at... the studies are probably written by INTJs as well :devil:
 
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