Are we over-assigning N to people here?

[Sol_]

About 25% of people are Ns

About 50%, most likely.

 

[ajblaise]

About 50%, most likely.

Really... want to give a brief explanation of that? Or why all other estimates got it so wrong?

 

[Siúil a Rúin]

most descriptions given describe functions in rather vague ways instead of using real world examples, which make the MBTI a lot more fun and interesting to someone in tune with the real world

more intuitives would probably find that approach at least interesting as well!

I think this approach would tend to be more exciting and interesting to people because it is more connected to a person's life.

The approach you described is the main thrust of discussions on this forum. There are a few times it is initially addressed in a theoretical way, but it quickly evolves into descriptions of actual people and experiences from real life.

 

[Snow Turtle]

I don't think we're over-assigning tremendously if we're looking at the population who actually post on this forum. While members might have an incorrect type at the beginning, over time they'll probably figure out what their true type is as they delve deeper into the theory.

I know for myself... I went through all the IXSX types before finally arriving at ISFJ. It took reading the profile several times, for all of it to finally click together. Reading up about functions only helped cement my understanding. While at times I wished to be an INFJ for the reasons mentioned earlier, what I wish for and what I am are two totally different matters. It doesn't really matter anymore.

People who are honest with themselves and seek to understand themselves will eventually find their true type. People here are more likely to be interested in seeking out the truth about their personality than others, so I figure it's not totally inaccurate.

I guess if you really want to figure out things statistically. Just use the members with +100 or +200 to determine the population.

 

[Jaguar]

I always thought the bolded was equally, if not more, made up of sp's. Also this environment has a serious case of N worship overall. Of course we are going to want to put an n on anything "creative" or "exceptional".

Can you imagine someone not making the connection of SP 'Artisan,' with an artist?
Artists -or anyone- with exceptional perception of color are using Se.
How someone cannot know that, is nothing short of shocking.

Are all ISFPs artists? No.
But it's no shocker this profile of an ISFP is called, 'The Artist.'

Portrait of an ISFP

 

[michL87]

I always thought the bolded was equally, if not more, made up of sp's. Also this environment has a serious case of N worship overall. Of course we are going to want to put an n on anything "creative" or "exceptional".

You're right -- sorry, I wasn't paying attention to what I was saying, as I was rushed to get out of the house.

The main reason I think we assign so many N's are that a lot of what we're talking about are fictional characters created in writers heads, and that a lot of writers who get famous enough for us to type their characters are N's themselves

 

[miss fortune]

I just don't get the idea that people have that Sensors can't imagine things and be creative... take a good description of someone or something from a book- a good author can make you smell the leaves that are crunching underfoot, or make you taste and sense the texture of the cake that someone is eating or make you feel the texture of the man's skin as the woman runs her hand across it... the author couldn't describe that without using Se and Si... feel it so intensely that the feeling sticks in your memory, so that you can recall it in such detail as to describe it well to others in the future- that's Sensing

A Sensor might be less likely to set a story in a make beleive land, but it would certainly not be out of question to write a novel basing characters on people who I know- people with quirks, with pasts, with relationships- a good number of characters in literature are based on people that the author knows! (why do you think that there's regions of California where you still should not mention the name Steinbeck to the elderly?)

Many plots in stories are based on real life events, or the logical conclusions that can follow up a What If? question... :rolli:

the idea that a sensor cannot be a great author is rediculous- I think that a lot of intuitives around here refuse to recognize that Sensors ARE capable of creating insightful and creative things- we all have S and N... it's the use of BOTH of them that creates a good story!

Just because an Intuitive CONNECTS with the character doesn't mean that the character or author are Intuitive themselves... some of the members on this board that I connect best with are Intuitives

 

[michL87]

I just don't get the idea that people have that Sensors can't imagine things and be creative... take a good description of someone or something from a book- a good author can make you smell the leaves that are crunching underfoot, or make you taste and sense the texture of the cake that someone is eating or make you feel the texture of the man's skin as the woman runs her hand across it... the author couldn't describe that without using Se and Si... feel it so intensely that the feeling sticks in your memory, so that you can recall it in such detail as to describe it well to others in the future- that's Sensing

You're so right about that! Whenever I go back to edit my novels, the one thing missing most is the surrounding scenery and what's coming in through the senses. It's always dialogue and internal thoughts. So then I have to go back and add all of the "S" things, because a novel needs to include both "S things" and "N things."

And I agree that sensors can definitely be creative! It's just creativity in a different sense. (Literally. Haha.)

So back to the original question of why we type more people as N's then are in the normal population. A new theory that takes into account fictional characters (since a lot of times we're typing characters from books, movies, and tv shows) is that the writers like to have characters who are different from one another in order to create conflict and different ways to view situations. Therefore, it's more likely that the characters will be half N and half S, even though this isn't equal to the real population.

 

[Matthew_Z]

I am one of those over-assigned people. The first MBTI test (well, KTS actually) test I ever took ended up placing me as an ISFJ. I just don't tell people that because my Fe wants for me to fit in, and with all the theoretical subtype theories, one of them has to sound like me. Of course I need you all to believe I'm a stoic type so you think nothing's going on when I send messages to Entropie that could be interpreted as expressions of latent homosexuality if you didn't know any better. (which you do, of course)

 

[1104]

Is it because since we're a bunch of Ns, that we just like typing other Ns, or is it a bias that makes us want to type people we like as Ns like us?

the second one.
the Ixxx prescription is due to a misunderstanding of what Introversion is. Paris Hilton is introverted.

Are artists putting out false N vibes of appearing "deep" and introspective?

there are always false vibes. it's our fault for attributing it to N only (and the delusion that they aspire to N enough to fake it.)

 

[Southern Kross]

I don't think we're over-assigning tremendously if we're looking at the population who actually post on this forum. While members might have an incorrect type at the beginning, over time they'll probably figure out what their true type is as they delve deeper into the theory.

I know for myself... I went through all the IXSX types before finally arriving at ISFJ. It took reading the profile several times, for all of it to finally click together. Reading up about functions only helped cement my understanding. While at times I wished to be an INFJ for the reasons mentioned earlier, what I wish for and what I am are two totally different matters. It doesn't really matter anymore.

People who are honest with themselves and seek to understand themselves will eventually find their true type. People here are more likely to be interested in seeking out the truth about their personality than others, so I figure it's not totally inaccurate.

I guess if you really want to figure out things statistically. Just use the members with +100 or +200 to determine the population.

I'm starting to think that more needs to be done with MBTI in regards to sensors. A lot of the inutitor talk and biased tests/descriptions has really been detrimental for you guys. I wish that everyone would feel fulfillment and satisfaction in discovering their type rather than it be something you have to come to terms with. It really sucks that you've been made to feel that way.

I guess we need more sensors writing about MBTI. I think we could all benefit from their insights.

 

[Arclight]

It's out of control..
people who are drawn to performance arts would most likely be performance artists.. ESFPs

And artists.. well they are artists.. ISFPs

The reasoning that types will be drawn to works of their types is flawed and fancyful.
Just because I might be an INFP and Like Curt Cobain does not make him an INFP..

Intuition is not synomunous with art nor with insight.

Something else.. To be famous you have to be an oppurtunist often requiring stepping all over other people and being VERY aware of what's going on NOW

I am nothing like Stephen King.. but I love his work.. I am nothing like Thom Yorke but I love his work.. I am nothing like Black Francis .. but yeah I love his work.

And as mentioned in OP.. if sensors make up 75% of the population then They make up 75% of population and that includes famous people.

Just my 2 cents on the issue

 

[Aleksei]

About 25% of people are Ns, but in these threads, N gets assigned to about 75% of people, it seems. Introversion too, a lot. Is it because since we're a bunch of Ns, that we just like typing other Ns, or is it a bias that makes us want to type people we like as Ns like us?

Are artists putting out false N vibes of appearing "deep" and introspective, but are not?

Intuitors just tend to be attracted to sites like this much more than sensors. We might have a bit of an N bias because we're Ns, but rest assured the majority of people here are Ns anyway, so it's no biggie.

 

[the state i am in]

Intuition is not synomunous with art nor with insight.

Something else.. To be famous you have to be an oppurtunist often requiring stepping all over other people and being VERY aware of what's going on NOW

And as mentioned in OP.. if sensors make up 75% of the population then They make up 75% of population and that includes famous people.

Just my 2 cents on the issue

this is really poor logic. one general population claim doesn't map onto smaller, more specific populations in perfect proportion.

and the ""requiring stepping all over other people" is not true either. there are many examples of highly intuitive bands who have done things in a way that has been conscious of their ecological footprint, so to speak, aware of the way they effect others.

also, intuition does have the capacity to produce a unique kind of insight. it's synonymous with the imagination, that's why it's NOT concrete. it's imagining something in the mind's eye, playing with it, simulating it internally, rather than focusing on what lies before you in terms of tangible, sensible objects. it abstracts because it can combine information from a wide variety of sources (in different domains), or process information from a wide variety of sources, simultaneously. it allows a smooth scaling when dealing with symbolic information, understanding how information can relate without spelling it out. it's the intuitive leap, you don't have to show your work, you can find a way to make them meaningful by imagining possibilities for meaningful connection and meaningful difference.

 

[Arclight]

this is really poor logic. one general population claim doesn't map onto smaller, more specific populations in perfect proportion.

and the ""requiring stepping all over other people" is not true either. there are many examples of highly intuitive bands who have done things in a way that has been conscious of their ecological footprint, so to speak, aware of the way they effect others.

also, intuition does have the capacity to produce a unique kind of insight. it's synonymous with the imagination, that's why it's NOT concrete. it's imagining something in the mind's eye, playing with it, simulating it internally, rather than focusing on what lies before you in terms of tangible, sensible objects. it abstracts because it can combine information from a wide variety of sources (in different domains), or process information from a wide variety of sources, simultaneously. it allows a smooth scaling when dealing with symbolic information, understanding how information can relate without spelling it out. it's the intuitive leap, you don't have to show your work, you can find a way to make them meaningful by imagining possibilities for meaningful connection and meaningful difference.

NO it is not poor logic.. You simply do not relate to it.. Someone who sees the bigger picture would understand how small and insignificant their own opinion truly is, and would qualify that everytime they expressed it.

You express your opinion as fact.. I do not.. I leave my opinion open to being wrong or limited by my own perceptions.

I would never say YOU are wrong.. only offer an alternative possiblity.

Just look at our interaction concerning Leonard Cohen and tell me I am the one closed to possibilities .

 

[Laurie]

^hahaha

 

[Arclight]

^hahaha

Oh what a well thought out retort.. I expect nothing more from someone who can't see beyond their own nose..:hi:

Of course that is just my opinion and you can think what you like!!

See how easy it is?

 

[Laurie]

Fi rooles don't apply to everyone. Not everyone agrees with your random phrase that supposedly makes all your nonsensical posts ok.

 

[Totenkindly]

I always thought the bolded was equally, if not more, made up of sp's. Also this environment has a serious case of N worship overall. Of course we are going to want to put an n on anything "creative" or "exceptional".

Pretty much that is what happens. But as Jag also mentions (in regards to color), the aesthetic quality is going to demand some level of actually paying attention to detail.

N is about making connections between things, not about being artistic or creative per se. It's just that creativity has as part of its components the ability to make connections between seemingly disparate things, so N's more naturally get tied to creativity.

In art, generally I find that N's are more interested in subtext -- the work in some way reflects a lot of underlying connections moreso than the actual observable detail of the work. More suggestive. S's are more interested in the actual elements themselves, the more tangible and visible interaction. In general.

But both are creative and artistic.

And then you get the overlap, where (for example) some of the INFJs I know will, in their art, be far more structured (and I bet INTJ falls into this too) -- in their visual arts, they are literalists and practicalists... painting or drawing the exact detail of what is in front of them. But their personality is obviously INxJ. So you can't even say that someone who is an N will not do art more like a typical S.

 

[Virtual ghost]

NO it is not poor logic.. You simply do not relate to it.. Someone who sees the bigger picture would understand how small and insignificant their own opinion truly is, and would qualify that everytime they expressed it.

You express your opinion as fact.. I do not.. I leave my opinion open to being wrong or limited by my own perceptions.

I would never say YOU are wrong.. only offer an alternative possiblity.

Just look at our interaction concerning Leonard Cohen and tell me I am the one closed to possibilities .

Trust him, it is poor incorrect logic.

For example toward your logic only a few percent of great scientist in history would be NTs. So I hope that you can see the hole in your logic.