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  1. #11
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Yes, I thought Freud was an S. He's quite the empiricist, who then adds a great deal of pseudo-N talk to the data. (He started out as a hardcore data collect for... what was it... hysterectomy patients?)

    Many of his ideas seem to be comprised of bits and pieces of data taken from his research but then connected in illogical or inconclusive ways and treated conclusively. N's tend to start with a framework and piece data into it.

    I'd at least give him a TJ rating.
    My impressinon is that Freud is an INTJ. His system is very intuitive and unprecedented. I don't agree with much of Freud, but his ability to perceive the unconscious is about as hardcore N as I know about. To be able to perceive that in a world where no one did? Doesn't that require iNtuition? He also understood how to elicite information out of people. He understood about how to draw out projection, use stream of consciousness, make connections between people's deep internal symbols. Dream imagery is all about reconciling paradox. Freud was an Ni. Freud was a profound, if at times mistaken, thinker. The one pitfall of iNtuitives is that they may develop an exhaustive, abstract system that is pure unto itself, but doesn't fit perfectly with reality and the concrete world. Hats off to Freud as our poster boy for this. It is also important to note that most every leader of thought in the early twentieth century was wildly dogmatic, and expecting absolute allegience from their followers. This is true whether it is psychology, harp technique, science, politics. There was so much change in the twentieth century, that people would find a new idea and cling to it with the fervor of a long standing tradition. That was all they knew to do.

    I need to read more, but i have suspicions that Jung is an INFJ.

    I've been going through my psych book with personality hypothesis. Most are actually extroverts and there are some hardcore Sensors as well. It's kinda interesting. These two here though are Ni dominant imo.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

    I want to be just like my mother, even if she is bat-shit crazy.

  2. #12
    heart on fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    succubussister-in-law



    But Jung was an N, so everything he did was okay!
    And Freud was an S, so everything he did was evil!

    (You know how mystics think.)

    Jung did make a point that it was the dishonesty about Freud's affair that bothered him the most.

    I am not condoning anything that Jung did in his private sex life or making a value judgement one way or the other on Freud and his private sex life.

    I do agree with what Jung says in the book about individuality and the dangers of groups, I do find his work on personality, dreams and anima/animus fascinating.

    I am making no guesses about their types.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Blackwater's Avatar
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    but his ability to perceive the unconscious is about as hardcore N as I know about. To be able to perceive that in a world where no one did? Doesn't that require iNtuition?
    not to start a fight or anything but kierkegaard, nietzsche and schopenhauer all talk of the sub-concious
    best collection of philosopher typings online

    http://www.celebritytypes.com/philosophers/

  4. #14
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toonia View Post
    My impressinon is that Freud is an INTJ. His system is very intuitive and unprecedented. I don't agree with much of Freud, but his ability to perceive the unconscious is about as hardcore N as I know about. To be able to perceive that in a world where no one did? Doesn't that require iNtuition?
    Meh. I completely disagree. You are approaching it from an outside-in, I am approaching it from the inside-out, so we're both dragging some of our biases into it, I suppose.

    S's can "emulate" N and N's can emulate S. It's just that usually both tend to be bad at the emulations... or they just use it in service of their true function preference.

    Freud comes off like a pseudo-N to me. He develops N-style theories but in an S way. It's much like a conspiracy theorist -- many of them are invariably S's whose [weak] intuitions are just being used to support their paranoia and S-style perspectives of the world around them.

    I never found Freud very "profound" like I find Jung; and maybe in that comparison you can see them as very different animals. Jung is about as N as you can get. It's one reason why Freud was so furious, I think.

    But then again, we all know I have trouble telling the difference between INTJs and ESTJs.

    I need to read more, but i have suspicions that Jung is an INFJ.
    The basic arguments are:
    1. In some ways, he seems very INFJ (and I think a case could be made for it).
    2. However, Jung classified himself as an introverted Thinker (IxTP).
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  5. #15
    Senior Member Blackwater's Avatar
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    the question of jungs type will never die. he is a present claimed by intp, intj, and infj

    he said himself that he was an introverted intuitive type who also used thinking.

    in mbti terms that would be INTJ

    i personally regard him as an INTP, though. his endless technical reservations whenever he wants to say something being a signature trait of the intps.

    then there's also my pet theory: that jung had TWO superior functions
    best collection of philosopher typings online

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  6. #16
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    Since he was into mysticism I would have to say if he was a thinker he was INTJ.

  7. #17
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackwater View Post
    then there's also my pet theory: that jung had TWO superior functions
    Sigh... Jung knew what he was doing, didn't he? I really need to create my OWN personality theory -- where I inadvertently am the pinnacle of human existence!

    [Tosses Jung into the file folder that includes Jesus and Hitler and others...]
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  8. #18
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackwater View Post
    not to start a fight or anything but kierkegaard, nietzsche and schopenhauer all talk of the sub-concious
    No that's a good point. There was a precedent set. I don't think that significantly changes what i was saying. My hypothesis of Freud's contributions in working with the subconscious implying iNtuition isn't significantly different if his contribution was less unprecendented.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer
    The basic arguments are:
    1. In some ways, he seems very INFJ (and I think a case could be made for it).
    2. However, Jung classified himself as an introverted Thinker (IxTP).
    I realized that while in the shower. My familiarity is greater with MBTI than Jung. What stands out to me from what i know is that Ti is a process of selecting the most accurate axioms and then forming the most ideal thought based on rigorous logic and the dismissal of everything that doesn't stand the test of scruntiny.

    What i've read of Jung so far is that he tends to embrace a wide range of things, is drawn towards the most subjective of systems, seeks to embrace and then form connections. That is my thought process which i have understood is N based. I wonder if Jung is Ti dominant, what would Ni dominant look like if not like Jung? I'm certainly not going to suggest he's different than he claims, but it does lessen the role of logic and dismissal as an important aspect of Ti. I think the idea of INTP must have evolved since his time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    [Tosses Jung into the file folder that includes Jesus and Hitler and others...]
    Ha. Well that settles it. Isn't there a great big red tag on that folder that reads INFJ? Btw i think Ghandi, Marilyn Manson, Robert Deniro, and Bambi are also in that folder.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

    I want to be just like my mother, even if she is bat-shit crazy.

  9. #19
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    Bambi was a J?

  10. #20
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toonia View Post
    Ha. Well that settles it. Isn't there a great big red tag on that folder that reads INFJ? Btw i think Ghandi, Marilyn Manson, Robert Deniro, and Bambi are also in that folder.
    hee -- my file folder was just labeled "Beings with a commonly disputed type" .. but you're right, they're all beings considered for INFJ label! (You forgot Johnny Depp, btw. )

    Bambi? Bambi has a personality? Thumper had a personality... but Bambi?
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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