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  1. #21
    Senior Member Little_Sticks's Avatar
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    I saw this a long time ago, but I remember it well so...

    Please note that an MBTI ISFP is considered to have Fi+Se functions. But these definitions are different from Jungs and less coherent. The MBTI dichotomies line up with different Jungian functions. So an ISFP to me is Si+Fe. If MBTI wants to create a new theory, it should use different names for the functions then. It's highly annoying and very idiotic to contradict the source they were taken from.

    for instance, going by MBTI definitions, people will tell you that an INTJ with Ni-Te is a judger because of the second function. BUT, the first function is the strongest part of the ego and it colors everything else. They are a perceiver first. It's bullshit logic to justify nonsense that was already wrong to begin with.
    anyway...

    I figure
    Asuka - Se(Fi) or Fe(Si)

    Shinji - at least an introvert. non-judgmental/perceiver, so that leaves Ni and Si. Whether you say Si-Fe (ISFP) or Si-Te (ISTP) I guess will depend on what you want to then assume. Some people only have a first function. Dom-Tert loops are sometimes used to justify these differences, but they are way too nuanced. dom-tert loops are an interesting idea, but it's not at all empirical and extremely vague.

    Gendo - introvert. judgmental, so that leaves Ti and Fi. Fi is not him at all. Ti fits well. Either INTJ or ISTJ.

    Rei - hmmm...she was kind of unreal. Didn't have a thought about anything and just did what Gendo wanted, mostly. The way she thinks is kind of empty. I guess that was the point since she wasn't supposed to be human. There's really not much to go on as far as personality.

    Kaworu - some kind of extrovert. Either Se or Ne, Fe and Te doesn't make much sense. Fi as the second function seems to make much more sense than Ti.

    Pen-Pen - GOD

    I don't remember any of the other characters. I guess there was the lady that liked to sleep around or something and the scientist lady who was probably an actual Fi type. But I don't really remember that much.

    Does this resonant with what you thought?
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  2. #22
    ... Tyrinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little_Sticks View Post
    Pen-Pen - GOD
    Haha.

    Quote Originally Posted by Little_Sticks View Post
    Does this resonant with what you thought?
    I don't know. Personally I have always seen Shinji as INxx, and it's going to be difficult to convince me otherwise. He just seems to detached and distant when it comes to most things for me to agree with S. There are certain things that just don't sit right with me. Calling Asuka an I or Rei an E are other such things.

    (I have actually seen Rei typed as E... I mean, what?)
    ...

  3. #23
    Senior Member Little_Sticks's Avatar
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    You guys do know that being an angry/bipolar/PTSD enneagram eight, doesn't have anything to do with utilizing thinking functions over feeling functions, right?

  4. #24
    ... Tyrinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little_Sticks View Post
    You guys do know that being an angry/bipolar/PTSD enneagram eight, doesn't have anything to do with utilizing thinking functions over feeling functions, right?
    We are talking about a show that is basically the DSM-IV in a blender. There is a reason I haven't been debating T vs F, and have been sticking to the other three.
    ...

  5. #25
    Senior Member Little_Sticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    I don't know. Personally I have always seen Shinji as INxx, and it's going to be difficult to convince me otherwise. He just seems to detached and distant when it comes to most things for me to agree with S. There are certain things that just don't sit right with me. Calling Asuka an I or Rei an E are other such things.
    Well,
    INxx implies either Fi-Ne, Ni-Fe, Ti-Ne, or Ni-Te. How are you defining the functions? Despite the rhetoric often used here, reason aims to persuade; it needs no convincing. At least if we provide definitions, we can be much more persuasive about this. I would never want to convince anyone if it means not being persuasive.

    These are mine:


    4 types (*All types can be ethically inclined)
    NT - Conceptual Logos
    NF - Conceptual Pathos
    ST - Pragmatic Logos
    SF - Pragmatic Pathos
    Logos -> Philosophical Logic
    Pathos -> Philosophical Communication


    introversion/extroversion
    extroversion -> evolutionary - actions are intentionally made that have an equal and opposite reaction that causes it to both 'impart' an affect on the external world and at the same time 'take in' new information of that affect.

    introversion -> involution - to be without action and thus without incurring any intentional equal and opposite reaction on the world; instead it synthesizes the affects of the world.

    *I say "intentional" because technically we affect things whether we choose to or not.


    8 functions (preceding from the definitions above)
    Te (external director/manager) - creates and deals with the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of philosophical Logos
    Ti (impersonal internal judge) - aims to assess an accurate and overall judgment on the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of philosophical Logos
    Fe (external influence) - creates and deals with the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of philosophical Pathos
    Fi (personal internal judge) - aims to assess an accurate and overall judgment on the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of philosophical Pathos

    Ne (external inventing) - creates and deals with the interaction of the world through a filter of concepts
    Ni (internal inventing) - aims to assess an accurate and overall understanding of the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of concepts
    Se (external resonance) - creates and deals with the interaction of the world through a filter of pragmatics
    Si (internal resonance) - aims to assess an accurate and overall understanding of the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of pragmatics


    Unconscious Functions to the Eight (Inferior)
    I consider this to be described as above, but that its use has to be stimulated or provoked.

    Creative Function + Tertiary
    Then you can add this too, I guess. But I don't know if it makes sense to say that the tertiary is unconscious. I classify it as conscious with the creative.

  6. #26
    Senior Member Little_Sticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    We are talking about a show that is basically the DSM-IV in a blender. There is a reason I haven't been debating T vs F, and have been sticking to the other three.
    That's true.
    But I think with proper definitions, even if it still feels like categorizing, which is what we're inevitably going to do anyway, no matter how we slice it, it should help elucidate something about that person's motivations/psyche. you know? Or else what is the point of any of this?

  7. #27
    ... Tyrinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little_Sticks View Post
    Or else what is the point of any of this?
    There has to be a point? I don't know, maybe just seeing how characters are perceived by the people who view the show.
    ...

  8. #28
    ... Tyrinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little_Sticks View Post
    Well,
    INxx implies either Fi-Ne, Ni-Fe, Ti-Ne, or Ni-Te. How are you defining the functions? Despite the rhetoric often used here, reason aims to persuade; it needs no convincing. At least if we provide definitions, we can be much more persuasive about this. I would never want to convince anyone if it means not being persuasive.

    These are mine:


    4 types (*All types can be ethically inclined)
    NT - Conceptual Logos
    NF - Conceptual Pathos
    ST - Pragmatic Logos
    SF - Pragmatic Pathos
    Logos -> Philosophical Logic
    Pathos -> Philosophical Communication


    introversion/extroversion
    extroversion -> evolutionary - actions are intentionally made that have an equal and opposite reaction that causes it to both 'impart' an affect on the external world and at the same time 'take in' new information of that affect.

    introversion -> involution - to be without action and thus without incurring any intentional equal and opposite reaction on the world; instead it synthesizes the affects of the world.

    *I say "intentional" because technically we affect things whether we choose to or not.


    8 functions (preceding from the definitions above)
    Te (external director/manager) - creates and deals with the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of philosophical Logos
    Ti (impersonal internal judge) - aims to assess an accurate and overall judgment on the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of philosophical Logos
    Fe (external influence) - creates and deals with the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of philosophical Pathos
    Fi (personal internal judge) - aims to assess an accurate and overall judgment on the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of philosophical Pathos

    Ne (external inventing) - creates and deals with the interaction of the world through a filter of concepts
    Ni (internal inventing) - aims to assess an accurate and overall understanding of the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of concepts
    Se (external resonance) - creates and deals with the interaction of the world through a filter of pragmatics
    Si (internal resonance) - aims to assess an accurate and overall understanding of the interaction of the parts of the world through a filter of pragmatics


    Unconscious Functions to the Eight (Inferior)
    I consider this to be described as above, but that its use has to be stimulated or provoked.

    Creative Function + Tertiary
    Then you can add this too, I guess. But I don't know if it makes sense to say that the tertiary is unconscious. I classify it as conscious with the creative.
    You lost me. Like I have said in the past, I am horrible at typing people. INxx (To be more specific INFP) is just the vibe I get from Shinji. I can't explain why I think that. Heck, I could be wrong, I admit that. I can't even settle on my own type (Odds are I'm going to change my listing to Ixxx in the future). The problem is that if I believe that he's an INxx I'm probably going to argue that until I convince myself otherwise...
    ...

  9. #29
    Senior Member Little_Sticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    There has to be a point? I don't know, maybe just seeing how characters are perceived by the people who view the show.
    Well, I thought the point was to understand them better. Seeing how other people view them would help that aim, I would think, but maybe you have something else in mind. It just seems annoying when people make shallow claims to types; and then they try to back that up with shotty logic that tries to fill in the holes. Like people typing Asuka ESTJ and not even supplying any kind of rhyme or reason, especially after you just threw the idea out lackadaisically. Forer Effect is the first thing that comes to mind.

    And then some people have some ulterior motivation to use this to dominate other people; I get the impression they are more concerned about categorizing everyone and being right than they are at understanding them. I'm a strong believer in that once a person judges another, they stop trying to understand them. But anyway...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    You lost me. Like I have said in the past, I am horrible at typing people. INxx (To be more specific INFP) is just the vibe I get from Shinji. I can't explain why I think that. Heck, I could be wrong, I admit that. I can't even settle on my own type (Odds are I'm going to change my listing to Ixxx in the future). The problem is that if I believe that he's an INxx I'm probably going to argue that until I convince myself otherwise...
    Thank Gods. Even though you can't supply any reasoning, I appreciate your honesty; that you're so open about this, means you're not another lemming. Sorry, I'll stop being an annoying insect now.

  10. #30
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    Not sure about the 4 letters. She has got to be an enneagram 3 though. She does things a text book low health level 3 does. She also suffers a breakdown much like the description of how 3s disintegrate to negative 9 traits when stressed (apathetic and losing the will to fight).

    Some references:
    http://www.nervarchives.com/characters.asuka.php

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