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  1. #471
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hmm View Post
    Nope. Kerry was up in the polls right before the 2004 election and everyone thought he was going to win. I remember. I also remember afterwards, they were stunned and came up with a ton of different lame excuses as to why he didnt win.
    Bush was ahead in the polls during all of September and October.

    bush kerry poll.jpg
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  2. #472
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    I don't really think that's entirely true. There's a LOT to be said for Obama having to "pass" in a lot of respects. If he were more representative of black culture in America... I think things would have been different.
    Colin Powell could have run for president. He would have been a very viable candidate. Condoleeza Rice might have run also, giving us a minority twofer - first woman president and first black president, all in one.

    Neither of them probably wanted to go through the grueling process of a presidential campaign, for which I blame them not at all.

  3. #473
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Colin Powell could have run for president. He would have been a very viable candidate. Condoleeza Rice might have run also, giving us a minority twofer - first woman president and first black president, all in one.

    Neither of them probably wanted to go through the grueling process of a presidential campaign, for which I blame them not at all.
    Sure, they could have run. But they would have to "pass" the same way that Obama has. And in any case, there are still significant educational and economic disparities in America which I believe indicate that blacks are still a struggling (and oppressed, in some ways) minority. We have certainly come a long way in America, but racial equality and equity is still imperfect at best. Barack Obama as a candidate has effectively enfranchised more black voters than ever before, though... and that's a way to bring about change.
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    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

  4. #474
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    Barack Obama as a candidate has effectively enfranchised more black voters than ever before...
    What does this mean, exactly? Were these black voters unable to vote before, but since Obama they can vote? I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

  5. #475
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    What does this mean, exactly? Were these black voters unable to vote before, but since Obama they can vote? I'm not sure what you're trying to say.
    Probably it's simply they feel that he has grown up in a culture where he is more apt to understand their problems and feels that he will better represent them.

    Imagine yourself in a nation comprised mostly of black or asian women, and where the leaders predominately are drawn from that demographic. Imagine you've always felt like life was a struggle to be heard in ways it wasn't for non-white females, and that the politicians wouldn't fight for what you need because they never grew up in your environment and so they didn't understand your needs.

    Many black people seem to be attributing Obama that sort of connection. He seems to be "their candidate" in a field normally dominated by middle/upper class white people. He grew up without a dad. His mom died of cancer. Despite his higher education, which some people have tried to use to brand him as elitist, they seem to respect him.

    Frankly, everyone feels that way to some degree. Sarah Palin seems to speak for her brand of religious conservatives -- they'll vote for her because of the similarities, hence they feel a connection to her and that she'll represent them better. Even if that is crap. (It's exactly what THEY are doing as well, even if they don't articulate it quite as clearly.)

    People, even you and I, do that.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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  6. #476
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    People, even you and I, do that.
    Sure we do. I wouldn't deny it.

    But what you're saying is that Obama makes these people feel enfranchised. That's a reasonable interpretation of Eileen's post, but I want to hear from her on it.

  7. #477
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misty_Mountain_Rose View Post
    The current administration has done more toward un-doing fundamental American rights than any previous administration.

    The sad part is, this is not even close to true.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  8. #478
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Sure we do. I wouldn't deny it.

    But what you're saying is that Obama makes these people feel enfranchised. That's a reasonable interpretation of Eileen's post, but I want to hear from her on it.
    Yeah, that's basically it.

    Black folks have had the right to vote and have their votes counted for awhile now, but I think it makes sense that they haven't (to this degree) until now. Now they have someone to vote for who seems to represent them.
    INFJ

    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

  9. #479
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    Yeah, that's basically it.

    Black folks have had the right to vote and have their votes counted for awhile now, but I think it makes sense that they haven't (to this degree) until now. Now they have someone to vote for who seems to represent them.
    I agree with you that this is probably true. However, it appears to me to be entirely a matter of perception. On the other hand, if African-Americans in this country feel more enfranchised, I suppose they're more likely to feel as though they have, by one measure, achieved a sort of parity that they didn't have before.

    Which agrees with my post, if I'm connecting the dots correctly.

  10. #480
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    I agree with you that this is probably true. However, it appears to me to be entirely a matter of perception. On the other hand, if African-Americans in this country feel more enfranchised, I suppose they're more likely to feel as though they have, by one measure, achieved a sort of parity that they didn't have before.

    Which agrees with my post, if I'm connecting the dots correctly.
    It's a start, but I don't think that you can categorically state that oppression has come to an end. I'm really just disagreeing with the grandness of your original statement.
    INFJ

    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

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