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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    What we call fundamentalist today is probably equal to "plain-old Christian values." That is, the values of the 1800s, early 1900s, etc. There are spiritual christians who are less literal, don't take everything as it's said and are loose in their interpretations. But that's somewhat of a modern day phenomenon.
    So even in the 19th century, people read the Bible literally? I was under the impression that the return to literalism was a recent phenomenon.

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

  2. #12
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ygolo View Post
    So even in the 19th century, people read the Bible literally? I was under the impression that the return to literalism was a recent phenomenon.
    You might have had some enlightened people who followed a higher path in those days. But religion and morality was still pretty strict around those times for the lower end majority who weren't as well educated or artistic in their ideas. The 18th-19th century poets from the northeastern area were probably ideal as for being biblical non-literalists in their personalities.

    Edit: I don't think that you're necessarily seeing a "return to" literalist interpretations of the Bible. It's just that the advent of televangelism and megachurches makes it seem so.

  3. #13
    Oberon
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    Everyone believes his values to be best. That's why they're values.

  4. #14
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Everyone believes his values to be best. That's why they're values.
    But notice how when they mean "values voters" on television, they mean, "christian values voters." Hehe. Yeah. If they didn't value their values, they wouldn't be values.

  5. #15
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by ygolo View Post
    So even in the 19th century, people read the Bible literally? I was under the impression that the return to literalism was a recent phenomenon.
    Literalism was re-ignited with the first vernacular translations of the Bible generated by the Protestant Reformation. The King James translation of the Bible was commissioned to calm down the Puritans, who were getting fired up over John Knox's margin notes in the Geneva Bible. This dates literalism back as early as 1560, and hardcore Protestant exegesis has been going strong ever since.

  6. #16
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Literalism was re-ignited with the first vernacular translations of the Bible generated by the Protestant Reformation. The King James translation of the Bible was commissioned to calm down the Puritans, who were getting fired up over John Knox's margin notes in the Geneva Bible. This dates literalism back as early as 1560, and hardcore Protestant exegesis has been going strong ever since.
    So when did it die out exactly before it was re-ignited?

  7. #17
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    But notice how when they mean "values voters" on television, they mean, "christian values voters." Hehe. Yeah. If they didn't value their values, they wouldn't be values.
    While you are right about the common usage of the term, there are also Jewish and Muslim and Hindu values voters. More properly these all should be referred to as "religious values voters," to differentiate them from "freedom values voters" or "economic values voters."

  8. #18
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    So when did it die out exactly before it was re-ignited?
    Hard to say exactly; but the first- and second-century churches who were passing around Paul's letters (before they and other writings were assembled into the Bible) were reading them literally, just as they were reading the Torah. Literalism faded in places and times when people were unable to do the reading for themselves. So when people couldn't get access to the writings, or couldn't read Greek or Hebrew (or, later, Latin), literalism was simply impossible.

  9. #19

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    So why not just say "Christian values" instead of "small town values?"

    I don't like the ambiguity of what is being alluded to.

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

  10. #20
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    It's politics. Do you ever expect them to be straight with you? If they openly said christian values, liberals would get even more angry with them .

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