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  1. #81
    mountain surfing nomadic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    I have no idea where the bill is going to go from here.
    a lot of traders in the market agree with you.

  2. #82
    Striving for balance Little Linguist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    Yea... it's a clusterf***. I cannot blame enough the ignorance and inaction of the American people for so many years. Everyone informed on the matter saw something like this coming for MANY years ahead of time. Alas, there seems to be little hope of American people waking up and taking the necessary actions themselves to change the country and government without a huge calamity befalling us first.

    With that said I had some hope that the house republicans would display some integrity and keep this bill from passing as it is, because it is still a socialist pile of dung, as they themselves have said. However, it seems the republicans and democrats who voted no today did so mainly because they were offended by the s***y house speaker Pilosy and her hypocritical partisan BS, as opposed to voting no because the bill SUCKS BALLS and goes against their own sense of whats good for the country. I do not know why I expected politicians to actually display some integrity....

    I have no idea where the bill is going to go from here. The whole situation bothers me (as a staunch INTP :p ) because unlike most other things such as science and politics, I know very little about the workings of the overly complicated economy, and therefor have little insight of my own as to what a better solution would be. What scares me more than that is realizing that if I know so little about the whole system, then the average American most likely knows even less about it. Not trying to come off as arrogant, I'm just trying to call it how I see it.
    GO YOU!!!!!!! WOOO HOOOO!!!! At least an American with FIRE who knows that something is DAMNED wrong with the way things are going.

    I'm not saying this bill was the way to go. Hell, I don't know. Somehow America has to clean off its ass and get back on track. Not that way. But also not for crying to Europe for help after they dissed us for eight freaking years.
    If you are interested in language, words, linguistics, or foreign languages, check out my blog and read, post, and/or share.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by reason View Post
    Politicians have never been quick to attack themselves, so don't hold your breath.

    The market will correct itself, given time. It has been living a lie, and through prices has repeated that lie to countless individuals. Prolonging the lie is not the answer, even though it may appeal to politicians (who have short time horizons). Fortunately, enough people are irked, for various reasons, with the prospect of their tax money being used to bail out these corporations, that the snowball of lies may be stopped early. Or at least that's what I think.
    From what I know, you can count on this whole thing costing well over a trillion dollars when all is set and done, unless the bill radically changes (to the level of not even being a bailout :/ ). That vast amount of money wont be siphoned directly from the taxpayers, because I doubt there is any possible way to realistically take that much REAL money. In other words, you know this is all just going to be borrowed and freshly printed, making the problem EVEN WORSE by the same means that got us here in the first place! I'm borderline supportive of just letting the economy do what it's going to do without government interference, so it can adjust itself naturally, even if that does mean a recession/depression in the short term. Compared to the solutions being proposed now by the politicians, it'd be better for us in the long run...

  4. #84
    Striving for balance Little Linguist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    From what I know, you can count on this whole thing costing well over a trillion dollars when all is set and done, unless the bill radically changes (to the level of not even being a bailout :/ ). That vast amount of money wont be siphoned directly from the taxpayers, because I doubt there is any possible way to realistically take that much REAL money. In other words, you know this is all just going to be borrowed and freshly printed, making the problem EVEN WORSE by the same means that got us here in the first place! I'm borderline supportive of just letting the economy do what it's going to do without government interference, so it can adjust itself naturally, even if that does mean a recession/depression in the short term. Compared to the solutions being proposed now by the politicians, it'd be better for us in the long run...
    Which goes back to what I said about a combination of inflation/recession.

    That's what Germany had in the 20s.
    If you are interested in language, words, linguistics, or foreign languages, check out my blog and read, post, and/or share.

  5. #85
    homo-loving sonovagun anii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    ...and the Dow is down 600+ points as a result.

    Hmmm...
    High time for an end-of-the-world Fuckfest.
    There's reason to be afraid, and reason to open your heart. ~ Seal

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  6. #86
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anii View Post
    High time for an end-of-the-world Fuckfest.
    Did I say the world isn't ending?

    IT'S THE END! IT'S ALL OVER!

    (/me does is best to encourage world-ending morality shifts)

  7. #87
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    I believe the dow retreated to the 400 range around noon.

  8. #88

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    The Dow closed at
    10,365.45 (Down 777.68)

    I have no idea what happened at the end of the day.

    House Bailout Vote Fails!-dow-bail-news-close-jpg

    NYSE closed at 7204.01 (down 683.36).
    NASDAQ closed at 1983.73 (down 199.61).
    S&P 500 closed at 1106.42 (down 106.85).
    Russell 2000 closed at 657.72 (down 47.07).
    Attached Images Attached Images

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

  9. #89
    Content. Content? DigitalMethod's Avatar
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    Franklin-Jefferson revolution plox.
    "The life of the individual has meaning only insofar as it aids in making the life of every living thing nobler and more beautiful."
    - Albert Einstein

  10. #90
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    Good, maybe people will learn from their mistakes.

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