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  1. #11
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    Was that Pennsylvania agrarian society run off the back of slaves? Doesn't Hong Kong has some of the strongest anti-drug laws right?

    Can we really point to any society and say it's libertarian? Sure lots of society past and present have libertarian elements.
    Pennsylvania had slaves, but far less than the colonies to the south. They tended to be house servant types. Most of the farming was done by families or indentured servants.

    Hong Kong has strong anti-drug laws, but they aren't as bad as Singapore or Thailand. My point was that there have been some very libertarian societies in history, and many of the things that weren't libertarian about them were not in any way intrinsic to society. There hasn't been a completely communist society, either, but certainly "communism" has been tried.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  2. #12
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Pennsylvania had slaves, but far less than the colonies to the south. They tended to be house servant types. Most of the farming was done by families or indentured servants.

    Hong Kong has strong anti-drug laws, but they aren't as bad as Singapore or Thailand. My point was that there have been some very libertarian societies in history, and many of the things that weren't libertarian about them were not in any way intrinsic to society. There hasn't been a completely communist society, either, but certainly "communism" has been tried.
    Small-scale communism exists, there are communes all over the place.

    We might disagree on how radical of a philosophy libertarianism is, but it's never existed for a reason.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    Small-scale communism exists, there are communes all over the place.

    We might disagree on how radical of a philosophy libertarianism is, but it's never existed for a reason.
    See, that's what I am arguing. I think that forms of libertarianism HAVE existed, and I cited examples.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  4. #14
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    See, that's what I am arguing. I think that forms of libertarianism HAVE existed, and I cited examples.
    A society having some libertarian elements (many of which elements belong to dozens of other philosophies) doesn't make it one.

    Canada has universal health care, does that make them a socialist nation? No.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    A society having some libertarian elements (many of which elements belong to dozens of other philosophies) doesn't make it one.
    I was giving examples of societies which were more libertarian than not. I think that would qualify. These examples are places that were fairly libertarian, with a few non-libertarian elements, not vice versa. As I said, most of the non-libertarian aspects aren't intrinsic. Hong Kong would still be very rich and capitalist if drugs were decriminalized. Perhaps even more so.

    Canada has universal health care, does that make them a socialist nation? No.
    It could be one piece of evidence pointing toward Canada being socialist if it were, in fact, a socialist nation. It does not provide enough information alone.
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  6. #16
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    I was giving examples of societies which were more libertarian than not. I think that would qualify. These examples are places that were fairly libertarian, with a few non-libertarian elements, not vice versa. As I said, most of the non-libertarian aspects aren't intrinsic. Hong Kong would still be very rich and capitalist if drugs were decriminalized. Perhaps even more so.



    It could be one piece of evidence pointing toward Canada being socialist if it were, in fact, a socialist nation. It does not provide enough information alone.
    Hong Kong's government doesn't seem too powerful to be considered libertarian? It's certainly not minimalist or abolished.

    There is also the controversy about human rights violations in Hong Kong. As far as freedom goes, I would much rather live in the Western world.

    Human rights in Hong Kong - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Calling Hong Kong libertarian is a reeeacch.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    Hong Kong's government doesn't seem too powerful to be considered libertarian? It's certainly not minimalist or abolished.

    There is also the controversy about human rights violations in Hong Kong. As far as freedom goes, I would much rather live in the Western world.

    Human rights in Hong Kong - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Calling Hong Kong libertarian is a reeeacch.
    It's not perfectly libertarian, no. It is, however, (arguably) the most libertarian country in the world on economic issues, and it's a successful society. In fact, it would probably be even more successful (and clearly, more libertarian) if it were better on civil liberties. Ireland is a more libertarian country than the United States is now, and it has gone from being one of the most backward nations in Europe to an economic powerhouse in the last two generations. You seem to be operating under the impression that there is only libertarian and not libertarian, when there is actually a spectrum. Some freedom is better than none, and a lot of freedom is better than some.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

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