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  1. #841
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by serenesam View Post
    And this is exactly why I talked about experience earlier. Men by nature tend to be more competitive even at an earlier age. Girls tend to play with Barbie Dolls and I just don’t get how this would help them later in life when it comes to success. I suppose the only kinds of success would be harmony-driven, which once again, seems to point to counseling, teaching, helping handicap kids, and basically jobs that don’t pay well, or at least in comparison to some more male-dominated jobs such as the reality show Hell’s Kitchen where you have three extraordinary chef judges (it’s kind of sad there are no female judges). I’m not saying that women cannot be great cooks, just that it seems men are much better and efficient at it (hence, Chef Gordon Ramsey being able to cook so unbelievably amazing).
    Sorry but cooking is a matter of taste. Yes the man is competent but I doubt he's the pinnacle. It does lead to my old chef friends off handed quote though that men are chefs and women are cooks. He didn't fare well against my sister

    Anyhoo, is this a matter of nature or nurture? With my own daughter I'm appalled at how everyone goes for cute stuff. Apparently now her hair is too long I can't just use a pair of clippers despite her not giving even half a damn about hair.

    Is the female hangup about looks (I know, contentious but hardly unfounded) part of the female psyche or is it taught from an early age of being made to look pretty?

    Of I was a stay at home dad things would be very different and I hope I can have the proper effect later to ensure my daughter grows up as much of a swine in an argument as my good self and wants things like trousers with usable pockets instead of plastering herself in the advertising logos of overpaid waifs.
    And because of such a driven competitive nature, they tend to accumulate experience faster while females are still trying to complement their perhaps emotional somewhat fragile nature and so for them, it may take a bit longer to get their act or behavior together. But on the bright side, once they get it together, it can be amazing. Though if I was being rational, their emotional side isn’t totally eradicated because they may still retain some of it as they age.
    I don't think that this is true. I've seen very competitive women but it tends to be focused in an individual. Perhaps that's why I see so many f males and t females struggle. They are contradicting the expected, men address the object and women address the person?

    Either way I think it's high time we lost these meaningless labels in arenas where they have no bearing. How to get there though.....well I haven't figured that out yet.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?
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  3. #843
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    First, you are overgeneralizing. Many women don't have what you would call a "desired nursing personality".
    Men in nursing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Men in Nursing Occupations | Random Samplings
    Male Nurses: No Longer A Rarity

    Male nurses make up about 10%. Which means females make up 90%. So you are just plain wrong.

    Now, men might be "higher quality" nurses because....perhaps they are better than women?

  4. #844
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    Quote Originally Posted by serenesam View Post
    I suppose the only kinds of success would be harmony-driven, which once again, seems to point to counseling, teaching, helping handicap kids, and basically jobs that don’t pay well, or at least in comparison to some more male-dominated jobs such as the reality show Hell’s Kitchen where you have three extraordinary chef judges (it’s kind of sad there are no female judges).
    Sorry, I meant the reality show "Masterchef" instead of "Hell's Kitchen."

  5. #845
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Sorry but cooking is a matter of taste. Yes the man is competent but I doubt he's the pinnacle. It does lead to my old chef friends off handed quote though that men are chefs and women are cooks. He didn't fare well against my sister

    Anyhoo, is this a matter of nature or nurture? With my own daughter I'm appalled at how everyone goes for cute stuff. Apparently now her hair is too long I can't just use a pair of clippers despite her not giving even half a damn about hair.

    Is the female hangup about looks (I know, contentious but hardly unfounded) part of the female psyche or is it taught from an early age of being made to look pretty?

    Of I was a stay at home dad things would be very different and I hope I can have the proper effect later to ensure my daughter grows up as much of a swine in an argument as my good self and wants things like trousers with usable pockets instead of plastering herself in the advertising logos of overpaid waifs.

    I don't think that this is true. I've seen very competitive women but it tends to be focused in an individual. Perhaps that's why I see so many f males and t females struggle. They are contradicting the expected, men address the object and women address the person?

    Either way I think it's high time we lost these meaningless labels in arenas where they have no bearing. How to get there though.....well I haven't figured that out yet.
    I think the differences between men and women need to be acknowledged. It’s the same argument I have argued in other forums with regard to race needing acknowledgement. Human behavior is far more complicated than that which meets the eye. If we want to prevent or at the very least lessen discrimination, we need to acknowledge that there are indeed physical differences between men and women, and keep in mind, that I am not trying to put down women (as I too have a lot of female family members), and so it just seems that the biological bodies are “better suited” for certain jobs. Even the very act of natural breastfeeding can result in higher IQ for children if memory serves me correctly from reading an article a long time ago. This isn’t something that is negative but positive for society as a whole, in my opinion (hence the natural tendency to nurture should be preserved for those adult years due to the awesome accumulation of experience?)

    I think that a woman can have an abrupt awakening when she finally realizes that she may not be as physically strong as a man in the same way that a Black guy may start to have doubts about what his teachers taught him about everyone being equal yet when he stares in the mirror, he sees a Black image. A T-type woman may think to herself that her large breasts is somewhat inhibiting her from being the best physically strong person that she can possibly be in the same way that a Black guy can still experience racism even with all that educational conditioning that race doesn’t exist. Perhaps the solution would be to actually acknowledge such differences, I mean, there is nothing evil about taking service oriented jobs. I know society likes to make fun of people taking jobs that don’t seem to fit their gender but perhaps there is a bigger problem here extending far beyond the gender debate, which is general ego.

    People have a tendency to want to judge someone simply because of what they do for a living. It appears to be like the first thing people ask when you are out on a date with someone or when you meet people for the first time. While no actual explicit or conscious words are said, usually, people are intelligent enough to know and perhaps detect a vibe of condescension. This makes them feel inadequate and no, I don’t think there should be any shame to being a special education teacher or a nurse. I don’t think there should be any shame in being a bus driver too. This is the part where things get a little crazy or confusing perhaps, in that we think we are arguing about gender inequality when it might not have anything to do with gender.

    One of the flaws I think humanity in general tends to have is to take things for granted. The woman who is a nurse can’t seem to appreciate that she is a nurse. The teacher who is a teacher can’t seem to appreciate that he or she might not make as much as someone in Wall Street. The bus driver who fails to recognize that a world without bus drivers would be a disaster. The CEO who fails to recognize that another CEO makes more than him or her. Seriously, it is really all about gender, sex, or sexual orientation? Or could it simply just be performance in accordance to nature (natural ability)?.

  6. #846
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Honestly I'm not sure how anyone in this day and age can still be claiming that one sex is inherently superior to the other. This post is coming suspiciously close to troll-land in the nature of its claims and lack of support for them.
    You have seen nothing. I also believe there is a parallel between the color of a person’s skin and their level of value. Going beyond that, on a technical level, I also believe the tints and/or shades are correlated with worthiness. Some of it may be conscious, some of it may not be. It all depends on the specific details of certain cases. You would be surprised, yes, even in modern times, it’s actually quite popular worldwide.

  7. #847
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by serenesam View Post
    Seriously, it is really all about gender, sex, or sexual orientation? Or could it simply just be performance in accordance to nature (natural ability)?.
    Nope and that's a serious misunderstanding about the aims of equality.

    For example, there is no reason for men making up more of the ceo's in the world unless there are more male applicants (there are but not to the same extent). This is not an area where the differences beaten a male and female has any bearing on their ability to do the job. Ergo if someone considers their sex in the decision making then most likely they are being sexist. That's discrimination.

    Not letting a 100lb woman fight a 200lb man at boxing.... Well that's just sensible. You'll never get a decent fight for a start!

    Race is trickier because there's little generally known about the affects of race on ability that isn't tainted by bigots. Ergo it should be treated as just another facet of a person with as little inherent value as whether they drink coffee with cream or milk.

    Of course I'm approaching this from an hr standpoint. Outside of a work based role, why would you need to evaluate someone's capacity for a job? It's usually either common sense or not applicable at all.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  8. #848
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Nope and that's a serious misunderstanding about the aims of equality.

    For example, there is no reason for men making up more of the ceo's in the world unless there are more male applicants (there are but not to the same extent). This is not an area where the differences beaten a male and female has any bearing on their ability to do the job. Ergo if someone considers their sex in the decision making then most likely they are being sexist. That's discrimination.

    Not letting a 100lb woman fight a 200lb man at boxing.... Well that's just sensible. You'll never get a decent fight for a start!

    Race is trickier because there's little generally known about the affects of race on ability that isn't tainted by bigots. Ergo it should be treated as just another facet of a person with as little inherent value as whether they drink coffee with cream or milk.

    Of course I'm approaching this from an hr standpoint. Outside of a work based role, why would you need to evaluate someone's capacity for a job? It's usually either common sense or not applicable at all.
    I think it would be interesting if a man were to start his company and a woman did the same and then see who would make the most money? I also have to wonder who is more innovative and creative? I mean, it just seems as if a lot of people tend to be attracted to the male’s conception of what it means to be a successful entrepreneur.

    And even if a woman did make more money, what would be the numbers averaged (meaning, in general, who tends to make the most on average)?

  9. #849
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by serenesam View Post
    I think it would be interesting if a man were to start his company and a woman did the same and then see who would make the most money? I also have to wonder who is more innovative and creative? I mean, it just seems as if a lot of people tend to be attracted to the male’s conception of what it means to be a successful entrepreneur.

    And even if a woman did make more money, what would be the numbers averaged (meaning, in general, who tends to make the most on average)?
    What particular facet do you see sex adding to that whole experiment? You'd have to get a twin brother and sister to try it and ensure that the whole setup was identical which would mean a sterile environment and other such extrapolations. Basically it would be a meaningless experiment.

    Don't get me wrong, there are accepted differences both physical and mental but they are slight enough that in most cases they don't have sufficient weight to be considered.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  10. #850
    Level 8 Propaganda Bot SpankyMcFly's Avatar
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    These tennis women are being paid the same to play less tennis. Men play up to 5 sets and women up to 3.




    Yay! More privilege for womyn
    "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents... Some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the light into the peace and safety of a new Dark Age. " - H.P. Lovecraft
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