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  1. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    The progressive degeneration? So you do think 1st wave feminism contributed. So you think letting women vote, and own property, and practice law, etc... contributed to the destruction of the family? Are you saying you'd rather take those things away to preserve the family? And why on earth is all the weight on women to not go out and do civic things, and commercial things, and so forth? What does letting women do that destroy the family, but letting men do that preserve the way the family has always been?

    And you actually mention living standards as a factor. Great! If it's a choice between living standards and family (which I don't think it is), I'd say screw the family, and give me living standards.
    1st wave feminism was funded by the government so that women could get taxed. The government wanted greater control over the population but couldn't do this without women entering the workforce. When women entered the workforce they gave up their privilege of raising children and began serving the government instead. I don't think this is necessarily a bad thing for women it gave them a certain level of independence that was never given before. However women today are reported to be less happy than they were in the 1960s-1970's. Letting men work preserves the family because they have always provided for women since the dawn of humanity. It is a mans biological role to provide and protect for women, so to claim that women had always been oppressed is bullshit.


    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    I am sure I understand feminism much better than you,
    No you don't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    to answer your question. It has many strains, but the vast majority, and the most influential, are about giving men and women equal opportunities, and in some cases equal outcome. It is typically based on the notion that men do not have inherent superiority to women, but historically society has favored men based on that premise, and we must now actively work the undo that. That would be a fair assessment of feminism, and that is a completely reasonable proposal.
    When has society favored men historically? Men are biologically constructed to be physically superior to women. Historically jobs consisted of manual labor, it would have been unjust for a women to work a a job in a mine, or construction because they are biologically constructed by nature to breed children. Women were protected from the harsh conditions of the industrial revolution not oppressed by it. Men historically provided for women this is where chivalrous practices came from. In a prosperous society the death of 1 man isn't as catastrophic as the death of a female. Female reproduction is limited to 1 women every 9 months while male reproduction is unlimited. I suggest you do a little bit of research on evolutionary psychologist/biologist PH.D Robert Sapolsky.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR5jGMVZi1o

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    What are a woman's actual needs? I don't think there are innate biological needs for women. I can also tell you that society before feminism was completely hostile to the needs of individuals who happened to women. If the question is catering to the needs of people who are women, feminism overwhelmingly improved that, and to say otherwise is only an expression of utter ignorance.

    And all of your premises seem to depend on the idea that feminism has established a level of authority in the country that I don't think it has. Feminism is a dirty word in this society, for crying out loud. Where is this matriarchy you seem to be imagining?
    A women is happy supporting and caring for children, the sick and the needy. A women's role is a supportive one, this is why the majority of women today are happy working jobs as teachers, nurses, special needs assistants and so forth. Women also excel at languages and writing and learn to speak at an earlier age than boys. While boys are interested in math and sciences and applying theory to practice and exploring the physical world. Society before women wasn't as hostile as the feminists make you think I can tell how manipulated you really are. Feminism is the religion of the western world. It is taboo to be critical and objective about feminism in the west. People in this thread have no proper means of arguing with me so they insult me and tell me to "man up". This is what society teaches boys at an early age to do when confronted with the needs of women.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    You are basically making a bunch of shit up. There is no gynocentric society, feminists don't want what you say they want in the vast majority of cases, and Obama didn't really say what you think he said. You sound like you should be wearing a tin foil hat at this point.
    Yep it's gynocentric, and yes Obama did say "women are smarter than men it's the truth" he is the product of gynocentrism in the west.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    And saying that lawmakers would be afraid of backlash is so laughable, because all over the USA lawmakers are constantly making laws extremely unpopular with feminists in particular and women in general, and they don't care, and don't pay a price. Just read about abortion laws lately, or childcare, or employment discrimination, etc.

    You are living in an alternate reality.
    Nope. Abortion all over the western society is pro choice, a women can kill and take a man's baby away from him without any say. Unless these laws are slowly changing this is the reality of the situation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    That isn't even what I'm talking about. Pay attention. You said lower marriage rates. That means never getting married in the first place. A man could be forced to pay child support, or he could just act like a father, because people can live together and have kids on purpose without getting married. That wouldn't less valid as a family, in my view.
    yes but if he "just acted like a father" is he not required by law to pay for child support? I agree that co parenting is a bit better than marriage because a man doesn't have to give away 50% of his assets but you are still fucked if you are not financially capable of supporting that child.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    That;s a complex subject, but there's one thing that I can say with complete confidence first. It's not caused by single-parent households, or women having some kind of advantage over men. Poverty is often geographical and at least somewhat multi-generational. It has to do with access to education, transportation, health care, job opportunities, working law enforcement, and the like. This varies by place, and people are often born into these circumstances and follow the path of their parents. Other elements determine who winds up in these places. Racism is a classic example, and you get all but abandon urban housing projects without almost entirely black populations.



    Well, great, as I've already pointed out that this correlation is the product of a third variable, most likely. But even if were there, it doesn't actually say anything about a father figure per se, does it? It would also be caused by a house with one father and no mother, or more interestingly, could be avoided by a household with two mothers, now couldn't it?
    I think it would be much easier if a child was raised by two parents instead of one. You are a fool in thinking that the vast majority of children raised in our society is by a single father or two mothers. It's pretty obvious that due to our current legal system children are mos often raised by single mothers. The father figure in the west has become obsolete, boys grown up by single entitled mothers, grow up to cold and bitter towards women and society in general. They are taught at a young age to "man up" and suck up their anger instead of es pressing it. If they do express their inner energy they are put on ADD medication and told to sit down and learn subjects in school that have no practical value.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    I think you meant liability.

    Anyhow, you didn't even attempt to refute any of my perfectly good explanations for why birth rates have gone down. You also didn't attempt to rebut my point about why it might actually be a good things. Instead, you just asserted a whole cavalcade baseless premises. So, I might as well just stick my explanation.
    Birth rates have gone down for a number of reasons, one is increased taxes, the other is low marriage only 20% of men from ages 20-35 are getting married. Our dependance on technology is another factor.

  2. #112

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    OK, you obviously don't understand much about natural selection. This is wrong for two reasons.

    1. A successful society needs people who can perform a range of functions. A population that only consists of wealthy, smart people will collapse because they won't want or even be able to do menial work. Blue collar jobs might not appeal to your or I, but they are just as important. If women won't marry men who do this work, they and their genes will die out.

    2. A successful society needs to be able to sustain its numbers, so the new workforce is not overburdened by ageing. For this to happen, roughly the same number of men and women need to be reproducing, and they need to have at least 2.15 children on average (the replacement threshold).

    Your ideal society isn't Darwinian. It is just a poor attempt to justify your own selfishness.
    Selfish in which way?

  3. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by violett View Post
    Why don't men just rise to the challenge of evolving into more enlightened understanding men?
    This is what's happening men are choosing not to marry today more than ever.

  4. #114

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    Quote Originally Posted by jixmixfix View Post
    This is what's happening men are choosing not to marry today more than ever.
    No, its the opposite, women are choosing not to marry today more than ever.

  5. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by violett View Post
    Selfish in which way?
    Judging a man on how much he earns. I tripped you into admitting that this is a good idea.

  6. #116

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    Judging a man on how much he earns. I tripped you into admitting that this is a good idea.

    In which way?

  7. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by violett View Post
    No, its the opposite, women are choosing not to marry today more than ever.
    No it's clearly not the opposite. LOL 20% of men and 39% of women want to get married. You are so manipulated by feminism it's laughable.

  8. #118

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    Quote Originally Posted by jixmixfix View Post
    No it's clearly not the opposite. LOL 20% of men and 39% of women want to get married. You are so manipulated by feminism it's laughable.
    heh, not in my case.

    Catch me if you can, LOL.

    And if you do manage to catch me I'll be needing a pre-nup.

  9. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    In what capacity have you studied feminism? Have you studied it academically, like in college? Have you studied it professionally?

    And since you've been asking the question of others, what feminists do you know? Let's just stick with self-identified feminists. Do you have friends? How many? Family or current/former lovers, and if so, what would you say your relationship with them is like now?

    How much have you done unguided research of feminism? By that I mean, how much have you studied feminism directly at the source material, without going through any third party's interpretation?
    Yes I've studied it academically in college in my liberal arts program along with many other toxic marxist theories biggest waste of my time. Schools love teaching leftist ideology that have no practical value.

  10. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by violett View Post
    In which way?
    Re our little diversion. My thesis is that women only marrying men who earn more than them - despite their evolutionary imperative to do so - is destructive for society, as too many women are now primary breadwinners. In response, you said:

    It's definitely a good thing and means when those single women do choose to mate it will be with the best possible partner. Darwinism at its finest.
    You therefore think it's a good thing that in the future, more and more men and women are going to struggle to find a partner. At the least, this is somewhat callous and short-sighted.
    Likes jixmixfix liked this post

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