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  1. #281
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Some nations value private and public safety just a bit too much to adopt rights as foolish as the second amendement.
    Says a citizen of one of the top 5 arms exporters.
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  2. #282
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    Says a citizen of one of the top 5 arms exporters.
    Your point being?

  3. #283
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    That's a small part of it. The 2nd Amendment wouldn't have let the government do to its citizens what the Nazis did; I don't see why every nation doesn't have gun rights enshrined in their legal documents.

    I'm too young to have played red rover, but I am aware of the game from the 90s film Now and Then.
    You're also not much of a student of history either.

    The US government carried out systematic mass genocide against the native people of this country, and interned thousands of citizens of Japanese descent in camps during WWII.

    Hell, if we're really gonna go there, eugenics, which was easily the most memorable ideology of national socialist doctrine, was born and bred right in the American heartland. Not to mention the largest Nazi rally in history was held in New York in 1939.
    And so long as you haven’t experienced this: to die and so to grow,
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  4. #284
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Your point being?
    Do I really need to spell it out?

    Regardless of your country's own gun control laws it's absurd to say your country should be counted amongst those that value public and private safety when it's so actively involved in the arms trade.
    Take the weakest thing in you
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  5. #285
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    Do I really need to spell it out?

    Regardless of your country's own gun control laws it's absurd to say your country should be counted amongst those that value public and private safety when it's so actively involved in the arms trade.
    1. I never named any specific country.
    2. Countries and nations do not really do anything; individuals, citizens, groups, companies do.
    3. German citizens do value private and public safety in Germany. I don't know a single person who doesn't think the US's obsession with guns is insane.
    4. You can be against war at home and for bringing it elsewhere, like so many of your countrymen are. Finding that absurd doesn't make it any less true.
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  6. #286
    deplorable basketcase Tellenbach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind Up Rex
    The US government carried out systematic mass genocide against the native people of this country, and interned thousands of citizens of Japanese descent in camps during WWII.
    No nation's perfect. I dispute the genocide claim. Most native Americans died from disease and not from bullets or guillotines or concentration camps. FDR's executive order to intern 122,000 Japanese Americans makes him the worst president in American history; I've said this many times.

    Now let's look at American contributions: the airplane, electronic television, phonograph, Rock N Roll, Jazz, Hip Hop, electronic air conditioning, tablet, Tivo, Coca Cola, ketchup, transistor, and most of the top movies and television shows. Frankly, I'm not sure why you're bothering to argue such an obvious fact.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus
    Some nations value private and public safety just a bit too much to adopt rights as foolish as the second amendement.
    I'm thinking that all the innocent people being murdered by Boko Haram and ISIS would like to have guns. Guns are the great equalizer and every tyrant fears them. That is why Mao, Hitler, and Stalin all banned guns. That is also why Americans can never be conquered by any foreign army.
    Senator Rand Paul is alive because of modern medicine and because his attacker punches like a girl.

  7. #287
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    1. I never named any specific country.
    heh. please.

    2. Countries and nations do not really do anything; individuals, citizens, groups, companies do.
    This is just plain false.

    edit: Ah you mean in response to exports. I'm not sure exactly how directly involved the German government is in the arms industry, but certainly it could stop it.

    3. German citizens do value private and public safety in Germany. I don't know a single person who doesn't think the US's obsession with guns is insane.
    That's fine. I don't really care. You have your own unique history that forms your views on guns and we have ours.

    4. You can be against war at home and for bringing it elsewhere, like so many of your countrymen are. Finding that absurd doesn't make it any less true.
    Sure. But my whole point is that if that is the case then you have no right to be on your high horse about how your country "protects public and private safety" with its gun control laws. It's the equivalent of Americans with half their shit made in China bragging about their own environmental laws and tut-tutting Chinese pollution.
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  8. #288
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    No nation's perfect. I dispute the genocide claim. Most native Americans died from disease and not from bullets or guillotines or concentration camps. FDR's executive order to intern 122,000 Japanese Americans makes him the worst president in American history; I've said this many times.

    Now let's look at American contributions: the airplane, electronic television, phonograph, Rock N Roll, Jazz, Hip Hop, electronic air conditioning, tablet, Tivo, Coca Cola, ketchup, transistor, and most of the top movies and television shows. Frankly, I'm not sure why you're bothering to argue such an obvious fact.
    Your claim was that the Nazis could have never come to power in the US, because Americans citizens would have been able to resist via second amendment rights.

    The points that I made were to illustrate how the presence of second amendment rights hadn't made Americans any more able to resist atrocity by their government historically than Germans living under the Nazi regime. And, moreover, the cultural climate at the time would have in fact been highly conducive to some of the worst ideologies espoused by Hitler.

    I don't know how any of the other things you have written are germane to this discussion.
    And so long as you haven’t experienced this: to die and so to grow,
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  9. #289
    deplorable basketcase Tellenbach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind Up Rex
    Your claim was that the Nazis could have never come to power in the US, because Americans citizens would have been able to resist via second amendment rights.
    I didn't make this claim at all. Nazis or some other wacky loons can ascend to power in the US but they wouldn't have been able to round up and murder millions of people in the US because of the 2nd Amendment. FDR only rounded up 122,000 Japanese residents/citizens. He would not have succeeded and he would have met with resistance if he had tried to kill them.

    Also, you're kind of missing my point. FDR was a rabid socialist; he confiscated people's personal gold via executive order. My whole point was that socialism is a terrible ideology; idiots and tyrants like FDR only prove my point.
    Senator Rand Paul is alive because of modern medicine and because his attacker punches like a girl.

  10. #290
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind Up Rex View Post
    Your claim was that the Nazis could have never come to power in the US, because Americans citizens would have been able to resist via second amendment rights.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    I didn't make this claim at all. Nazis or some other wacky loons can ascend to power in the US but they wouldn't have been able to round up and murder millions of people in the US because of the 2nd Amendment. FDR only rounded up 122,000 Japanese residents/citizens. He would not have succeeded and he would have met with resistance if he had tried to kill them.
    Is this real? Am I being Punk'd right now? Is Ashton Kutcher going to jump out from behind your post at any minute and assure me that no one could in fact be this stupid?

    I need an adult. @Nicodemus, HALP.
    And so long as you haven’t experienced this: to die and so to grow,
    you are only a troubled guest on the dark earth
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