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  1. #1
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    Default The deafening silence of the anti-war movement this time around

    I find this tendency rather irksome, and would think (especially on a site as uniformly against military aggression at this) you guys would as well.

    From Andrew Sullivan's the dish:
    Is Obama Pulling A Bush?

    And the way in which Obama supporters have lamely acquiesced to this reckless war fomented by a dangerous executive power-grab is more than a little depressing. It strikes me as uncomfortably close to pure partisanship. I can’t imagine them downplaying the folly of this if a Republican president were in charge.

    Sure, we are indeed not being grotesquely misled this time about non-existent WMDs. But we are going to war despite the fact that ISIS is no more a direct threat to the United States than Saddam was – arguably much less, in fact. We have no answer this time to the unanswered question last time: what if our intervention actually galvanizes Islamist extremism rather than calming it?
    From the Washington Post:
    Obama endures as the lesser evil for liberals

    But the roll call of activists was short: Obama starts a war, multiple antiwar groups schedule a joint demonstration with plenty of advance warning — and only 22 people show up?

    It was the latest display of how Obama has neutralized the left.
    “If George W. Bush were launching wars with Congress out of town, oh, it would be flooded,” longtime liberal activist David Swanson said, looking across mostly empty Pennsylvania Avenue “They would be screaming.”
    I asked Benjamin, who like Swanson voted for Obama in 2008 before turning Green, why so few on the left oppose Obama. “He’s totally defanged us,” she said, citing his party, his affability — and his race. “The black community is traditionally the most antiwar community in this country. He’s defanged that sentiment within the black community, or certainly voicing that sentiment.”
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  2. #2
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    Yeah, I'm annoyed by the recent push for military action. Feel bad for Obama like I did for Bush, though - though I voted for Obama and not for Bush. Presidents do tend to get shat on no matter what they do. It's basically a constant that public opinion declines steadily through a president's time in office... It's the distance increasing between idealistic campaign promises and the difficult reality of dealing with a bipartisan legislature and real-world struggles. I feel like Obama has sold out in some ways... And in other ways it seems like if he didn't strike against ISIS, a majority of the country would flip their shit. So, yes, defanged, but that does tend to happen with presidents as they have to increasingly compromise and, in a difference vein, as they become lame ducks and just do whatever they feel like. I do wonder sometimes how much politics is just a public opinion game. I feel like I ought to be more interested in it than I am.

  3. #3

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    But we are going to war...
    We are? What constitutes "going to war"? I'm guessing definitions vary. Considerably.
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  4. #4
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    I am pissed off. The fact that everyone is so quiet despite being against the war efforts is very frustrating, and I am quite shocked at how eager most of congress is to start sticking our noses in this.

    As a general rule though I don't make political topics here because I prefer the conservative nuts here quiet, and without fail they jump on things and refuse to bend. It is a pointless endevor. I follow the news very closely though. I have for years.
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  5. #5
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    This should provide some insight:

    Why Hasn’t Michael Moore Made An Obama Documentary?

    Yep, I'm once again mentioning a RoK article.

  6. #6
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    The whole story is pretty complicated.

    You might recall that when Bush wanted to go to war with Afghanistan (or in, depending on how you want to put it), everyone was kissing his ass. It's only Iraq that started to cause problems. But if we look at the situation honestly, and not get blinded by 9/11 related sentimentality, was the invasion of Afghanistan that much better of an idea than the invasion of Iraq? The point is, Bush once had unreasonable bipartisan support, too.

    On the other hand, even now, Obama's position has never been that clearly to one side. As we speak, Obama has to deal with leftists who do hate his military action as well as right-wingers who are saying he's too soft and not belligerent enough, and this has basically been the story of Obama's entire presidency. And in truth, Obama's approach has been different. He's not talking about an invasion proper, and regardless of what he's actually doing, he's trying to pass over the subject, as oppose to Bush, who intentionally aggrandized the whole affair as much as possible. One can't ignore how much this probably changes the public response.

    What is sad is the fact that anti-interventionist views are so politically weak in this country, and have so little representation amongst either Republicans or Democrats. This topic, along with the increased government monitoring of citizens, is something we can only expect each successive president to step up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rasofy View Post
    This should provide some insight:

    Why Hasn’t Michael Moore Made An Obama Documentary?

    Yep, I'm once again mentioning a RoK article.
    You know, making self-referential emoticons doesn't lessen the fact that the site is actually fucking ludicrous.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  7. #7
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    On the other hand, even now, Obama's position has never been that clearly to one side. As we speak, Obama has to deal with leftists who do hate his military action as well as right-wingers who are saying he's too soft and not belligerent enough, and this has basically been the story of Obama's entire presidency. And in truth, Obama's approach has been different. He's not talking about an invasion proper, and regardless of what he's actually doing, he's trying to pass over the subject, as oppose to Bush, who intentionally aggrandized the whole affair as much as possible. One can't ignore how much this probably changes the public response.
    and regardless of what he's actually doing
    I mean, screw consistency, right? Providing he keeps telling the "progressives" whatever they need to hear, it's all good. Who cares if he does the same thing Bush does, at least his speeches make for good PR.

    If you don't mind, stop quoting me. You seem to think you're way smarter than you actually are.

  8. #8
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasofy View Post
    I mean, screw consistency, right? Providing he keeps telling the "progressives" whatever they need to hear, it's all good. Who cares if he does the same thing Bush does, at least his speeches make for good PR.
    Look at that context that statement is in (it's not hard, there isn't a lot). That was an objective description of what might be going on, regardless of whether or not it is right or wrong. That was a positive statement, not a normative statement. I am not a supporter of intervention in the Middle-East, and so accordingly not a supporter of Obama carrying it out. But the point remains, that a more polarized response is going to be garnered by actions that are presented more blatantly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rasofy View Post
    If you don't mind, stop quoting me. You seem to think you're way smarter than you actually are.
    No.

    If you want to say things on this forum, I can respond to them. I could respond to you without quoting you, but the quotes provide great value in terms of context, which I realize you may not have noticed since you clearly have no use for context.

    And if possible, I prefer to express estimations of intelligence in deed, rather than just commentary.
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  9. #9
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    tl;dr

  10. #10
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasofy View Post
    tl;dr
    Really? You manage to read that inane website... oh, wait! I understand! You don't even actually read the website and that's why you don't know how stupid it is.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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