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  1. #501

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crabs View Post
    It turns out that pandering to an angry mob for your own political gain isn't enough to convict someone of murder. Imagine that.
    This is nothing.

    I mean literally nothing but claims without any evidence or anything coming from a Lawyer who loves to stick his nose where it doesn't belong.

    Show me hard evidence and I'll change my position.


    Edit: I'm reading the complaint now.
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  2. #502

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    @Crabs

    That she did not have probable cause to believe that there was sufficient admissible evidence to support a conviction of the officers;

    This is the most ridiculous claim. The standard for probable cause is ridiculously low.
    He states that there was no evidence at all.
    That's an absurd claim.
    You have officer custody of an individual.
    You have that person dying from a high impact injury during that exclusive custody.
    Therefore you have probable cause.
    Exculpatory evidence isn't considered when it comes to probable cause.


    That she made public statements regarding the case which were false

    Some moron over at lawofficer.com got this complaint wrong all together.

    The issue is not whether she made false public statements (she didn't) but whether she made an "extrajudicial statement that the lawyer knows or reasonably should know will be disseminated by means of public communication and will have a substantial likelihood of materially prejudicing an adjudicative proceeding in the matter."

    Most of what he complains about were statements made for the purpose of pushing for peace at the protests.
    Nothing she said goes beyond what any normal person would infer from her pursuing the case in the first place. That is, that she thinks by pursuing a case against the officers she's pursuing justice.

    There are certainly many prosecutors that would have been more restrained, but I don't think she made any statements that would prejudice the public.

    Btw, none of this potentially made any difference since the officers opted for a bench trial and were let off.


    That she improperly withheld evidence from the defense that was exculpatory

    There's no evidence of this. We'll have to wait and see.


    Basically, I stand by my prior statement. Unless we see evidence that she withheld evidence then this is a bunch of bullshit and nothing will come of it.
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  3. #503

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    @Crabs

    That she did not have probable cause to believe that there was sufficient admissible evidence to support a conviction of the officers;

    This is the most ridiculous claim. The standard for probable cause is ridiculously low.
    He states that there was no evidence at all.
    That's an absurd claim.
    You have officer custody of an individual.
    You have that person dying from a high impact injury during that exclusive custody.
    Therefore you have probable cause.

    Some moron over at lawofficer.com got this complaint wrong all together.

    The issue is not whether she made false public statements (she didn't) but whether she made an "extrajudicial statement that the lawyer knows or reasonably should know will be disseminated by means of public communication and will have a substantial likelihood of materially prejudicing an adjudicative proceeding in the matter."

    Most of what he complains about were statements made for the purpose of pushing for peace at the protests.
    Nothing she said goes beyond what any normal person would infer from her pursuing the case in the first place. That is, that she thinks by pursuing a case against the officers she's pursuing justice.

    There are certainly many prosecutors that would have been more restrained, but I don't think she made any statements that would prejudice the public.

    Btw, none of this potentially made any difference since the officers opted for a bench trial and were let off.


    That she improperly withheld evidence from the defense that was exculpatory

    There's no evidence of this. We'll have to wait and see.


    Basically, I stand by my prior statement. Unless we see evidence that she withheld evidence then this is a bunch of bullshit and nothing will come of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    Show me hard evidence and I'll change my position.
    Interestingly, I don't recall you demanding evidence when Marilyn Mosby and half of Baltimore were rushing to judgement about what happened that day. An emotional frenzy swept over the nation and you jumped on the bandwagon, as usual. What happened in Ferguson and other cities was completely unrelated to the incident in Baltimore, as far as the law is concerned. The guilt or innocence of the officers in question had no bearing on any other case. Marilyn Mosby saw herself as a crusader for a political movement and completely overstepped her bounds. The fact that she hasn't been able to secure a single conviction highlights the lack of sufficient evidence. You jumped to conclusions about what happened in Baltimore because, like Mosby, you had an agenda. It was never about seeking justice. It was to pacify an angry mob who already assumed the role of judge and jury before the investigation was complete.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    Exculpatory evidence (that's not too big of a word for you is it?) isn't considered when it comes to probable cause.
    Don't worry about me. I assure you that my vocabulary is a lot more extensive than yours, you ignorant dunce. In other words (that your modest intellect can comprehend) your vocabulary is much more WORST than mine.

  4. #504

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    Typical.

    I write out a long analysis based on an original source because you used a crap source and you just fire off assertions from the top of your head.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crabs View Post
    Interestingly, I don't recall you demanding evidence when Marilyn Mosby and half of Baltimore were rushing to judgement about what happened that day. An emotional frenzy swept over the nation and you jumped on the bandwagon, as usual.
    The evidence was the dead body of Freddie Gray.


    What happened in Ferguson and other cities was completely unrelated to the incident in Baltimore, as far as the law is concerned. The guilt or innocence of the officers in question had no bearing on any other case. Marilyn Mosby saw herself as a crusader for a political movement and completely overstepped her bounds.
    How?
    I explained to you why that's not the case.

    The fact that she hasn't been able to secure a single conviction highlights the lack of sufficient evidence.
    I already explained to you what probable cause is and why this case meets that standard.
    Go back and read it.


    You jumped to conclusions about what happened in Baltimore because, like Mosby, you had an agenda.
    Quote me.


    It was never about seeking justice. It was to pacify an angry mob who already assumed the role of judge and jury before the investigation was complete.
    Nothing she said or did can justify that belief as I explained above.
    You're creating a false dichotomy. It's possible for her to both promote peace and to legitimately seek justice.

    Don't worry about me. I assure you that my vocabulary is a lot more extensive than yours, you ignorant dunce. In other words (that your modest intellect can comprehend) your vocabulary is much more WORST than mine.
    lol
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  5. #505

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    The evidence was the dead body of Freddie Gray.
    The dead body of Freddie Gray was evidence of murder? Who needs an investigation when you rely on that kind of logic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    Quote me.
    This entire thread speaks to your agenda, dude. You're not fooling anyone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    lol
    I laughed too when I read your post. Not sure where you got your education, but here we learn the difference between worse and worst in grade school.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    How?
    I explained to you why that's not the case.

    I already explained to you what probable cause is and why this case meets that standard.
    Go back and read it.

    Nothing she said or did can justify that belief as I explained above.
    You're creating a false dichotomy. It's possible for her to both promote peace and to legitimately seek justice.
    Do you live in a vacuum? Maybe you just have a selective memory that is colored by your prejudices. You probably don't even recall Marilyn Mosby pandering to the people of Baltimore at a Prince concert.

    Why Freddie Gray Case Could Make or Break Marilyn Mosby

    It was a swift, stunning move no other lead prosecutor in America had done during months' worth of headlines about police violence against black men.

    Many lauded Baltimore state's attorney Marilyn Mosby when she announced charges against six officers just days into the investigation into 25-year-old Freddie Gray, who died of injuries sustained in the back of a police van. But others criticized her as acting too hastily and overreaching in the charges.

    "It was clearly a rush. Keep in mind, the police got their investigation in on a Thursday, and she announces the next morning that she's decided to file these charges," said Warren Brown, a Baltimore criminal defense attorney who has observed the officers' trials.
    ....
    Two officers have already been tried without guilty verdicts: William Porter, whose trial ended in a mistrial in December, and Edward Nero, who was acquitted in April.

    And the Goodson trial, an uphill battle that would be the first conviction of its kind in at least a decade, is "clearly a stretch" according to Harvard University professor and prominent civil liberties attorney Alan Dershowitz.

    "She did it without any real basis in either the facts or the law," Dershowitz told NBC News. "Obviously what happened in that van was not intended by anybody. Nobody set out to kill this man. They may have done things they shouldn't haven't done, but she rushed to judgment."

    Initially, Mosby had charged three of the officers with false imprisonment in what she said was an illegal arrest, a "crazy theory that just makes no sense at all," Dershowitz said.

    Those were later changed to more serious charges, including second-degree murder and involuntary murder.

    "The charges just didn't fit the facts," he said. "She indicted them and only afterwards did she do the work to come up with, after the fact, rationalizations."
    ...
    A spokeswoman said Mosby wouldn't comment, citing a gag order against anything related to the Gray case. But the legal experts said her campaign platform may have colored her view on the officers.

    "She rode that wave of dissatisfaction, of not charging police officers, into office," Brown, the Baltimore attorney, told NBC News. "All of a sudden, Freddie Gray comes along. She has to for political reasons charge the officers."

    She filed charges because she "wanted to be the hero," Dershowitz said.

    "No prosecutor is ever punished for being too tough. They're always punished for being too lenient."

    But being too tough could cost her a conviction, especially in Goodson's case.

    "I think her hope was if you charge for murder, maybe they'll plead for manslaughter," Dershowitz said. "But the risk there will be an acquittal."
    Last edited by Crabs; 07-11-2016 at 06:52 AM.

  6. #506

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    I didn't mean to deter your anti-police thread, Beorn.

    Carry on.

  7. #507

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crabs View Post
    The dead body of Freddie Gray was evidence of murder? Who needs an investigation when you rely on that kind of logic?
    Yes.

    You kind of need a dead body for a murder.

    Anyway, the logic has quite a history and is pretty damn sound.
    So sound it's enough to win in a Civil trial.

    Res Ipsa Loquitur
    The thing speaks for itself

    Exclusive control over the Body + Dead Body = It's pretty damn obvious who did it

    This is why Baltimore settled for $6.4 Million

    Baltimore to pay Freddie Gray's family $6.4 million to settle civil claims - Baltimore Sun



    This is entire thread speaks to your agenda, dude. You're not fooling anyone.
    So you can't quote and you're just going to make baseless accusations against me?


    I laughed too when I read your post. Not sure where you got your education, but here we learn the difference between worse and worst in grade school.
    My only education is from a she-wolf who suckled me from birth.



    Maybe you just have a selective memory that is colored by your prejudices. You probably don't even recall Marilyn Mosby pandering to the people of Baltimore at a Prince concert.
    Yeah, I did forget it because I'm not strangely obsessed with this case like you are. I mean that strange obsession has led you to try to bring this case up with me in numerous threads where it's off-topic.

    The Prince concert was a poor choice and not becoming of her position.
    That doesn't prove it was unjust to pursue charges.
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  8. #508

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    So you can't quote and you're just going to make baseless accusations against me?
    I don't keep a record of all your quotes nor am I going to search through your previous posts to find them. I recall you changing your avatar to Marilyn Mosby and vehemently defending her actions which were hasty and presumptuous. This coupled with your apparent disdain for law-enforcement formed a pretty clear picture of your world view on these matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    Yeah, I did forget it because I'm not strangely obsessed with this case like you are. I mean that strange obsession has led you to try to bring this case up with me in numerous threads where it's off-topic.
    I'm not obsessed with this case at all. You were extremely vocal about the Baltimore incident, along with every police shooting, and I don't think you had a firm grasp on the larger picture outside of your dogmatic perspective. Every piece of information was filtered through this lens of "racism" which prevented you from seeing any nuances beyond that. And honestly, it doesn't sound like you've changed that much.

    I mentioned this case in another thread where you stated: "I just wish people would shut the fuck up about their agendas until the facts are in." Surely, you can understand why I found your comment amusingly ironic in light of your support for Marilyn Mosby and your propensity for reducing every police shooting (involving a black male) to a matter of racism.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beorn View Post
    The Prince concert was a poor choice and not becoming of her position.
    That doesn't prove it was unjust to pursue charges.
    If I recall correctly, you fully supported Mosby's concert appearance in the past so I applaud you for now seeing how that was inappropriate.

  9. #509

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crabs View Post
    I don't keep a record of all your quotes nor am I going to search through your previous posts to find them. I recall you changing your avatar to Marilyn Mosby and vehemently defending her actions which were hasty and presumptuous. This coupled with your apparent disdain for law-enforcement formed a pretty clear picture of your world view on these matters.



    I'm not obsessed with this case at all. You were extremely vocal about the Baltimore incident, along with every police shooting, and I don't think you had a firm grasp on the larger picture outside of your dogmatic perspective. Every piece of information was filtered through this lens of "racism" which prevented you from seeing any nuances beyond that. And honestly, it doesn't sound like you've changed that much.

    I mentioned this case in another thread where you stated: "I just wish people would shut the fuck up about their agendas until the facts are in." Surely, you can understand why I found your comment amusingly ironic in light of your support for Marilyn Mosby and your propensity for reducing every police shooting (involving a black male) to a matter of racism.
    More assertions from you while you IGNORE EVERYTHING SUBSTANTIVE I'VE SAID.

    Please.

    Explain to me why my analysis of why there was probable cause here is wrong.
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  10. #510

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crabs View Post
    If I recall correctly, you fully supported Mosby's concert appearance in the past so I applaud you for now seeing how that was inappropriate.
    Quote me.

    I don't need your damn applause.

    Edit: Just checked. You posted about it and I ignored you (and I wish I continued to ignore you up to this post).

    For someone who complains about agendas and bias it seems pretty damn dumb to expose your own blatant bias.
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

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