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  1. #1
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Default Jackbooted thugs



    If it wasn't for the "police" patches, you could easily be fooled into thinking this picture was taken in Iraq or Afghanistan. But it was taken in the US, where our police are sometimes more heavily outfitted than our military. It's clear who the real enemy of the state is. It's the people.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  2. #2
    morose bourgeoisie
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    yes, we live in a police state.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    I don't think the police need this kind of equipment. Where can I get a tax refund? Can I sue like Hobby Lobby sued?
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  4. #4
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    When the criminals have this, yes, it's necessary:


  5. #5
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    When I was in my previous apartment, I saw a van full of police with armor and automatic rifles pull up to the house from across the street, accompanied by some police cruisers, and they armored guys gave an ultimatum and a warning shot into the air before busting into the place. I was and still am in Millvale, a little annex of Pittsburgh with a really low crime rate, so this was on the bottom of my list of things I expected to see. From what I understand, the people in the household were running drugs out of their house. Since at this point my life I do not think that should even be a criminal offense, it's really bizarre to think that a squad of heavily armed men came to this place where nothing happens just to get these people. The actual break-in and aftermath was so anticlimactic that is punctuated how over-the-top the whole operation seemed.

    But I don't think it's the same as what is usually meant by police state. There is no revolution or counter-revolution here, no coup. The USA just sort of blindly stumbles its way toward something like a police state. The police force (along with the military) are simply large enterprises with a lot of power to leverage, which I think do so only for what are basically economic reasons, for their own business. Most of the rest of the powers that exist in this country are so atomized and uncoordinated, as well as sclerotic and complacent, that there isn't anything that puts up a resistance to even the rather modest and lethargic power grabs that the justice and defense systems are doing. And then of course there are the American people, who in spite of some fear mongering like we saw after 9/11, don't really accept these things for political or ideological reasons, but just tacitly accept them out of sheer apathy and ignorance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    When the criminals have this, yes, it's necessary:
    That makes want to know; how do the police handle these situations in countries where they do not carry guns?
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  6. #6
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    When the criminals have this, yes, it's necessary:
    How often are crimes committed with that type of weaponry, per jurisdiction? Once a week? Once a year? Once a century? I want data.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  7. #7
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    When I was in my previous apartment, I saw a van full of police with armor and automatic rifles pull up to the house from across the street, accompanied by some police cruisers, and they armored guys gave an ultimatum and a warning shot into the air before busting into the place. I was and still am in Millvale, a little annex of Pittsburgh with a really low crime rate, so this was on the bottom of my list of things I expected to see. From what I understand, the people in the household were running drugs out of their house. Since at this point my life I do not think that should even be a criminal offense, it's really bizarre to think that a squad of heavily armed men came to this place where nothing happens just to get these people. The actual break-in and aftermath was so anticlimactic that is punctuated how over-the-top the whole operation seemed.

    But I don't think it's the same as what is usually meant by police state. There is no revolution or counter-revolution here, no coup. The USA just sort of blindly stumbles its way toward something like a police state. The police force (along with the military) are simply large enterprises with a lot of power to leverage, which I think do so only for what are basically economic reasons, for their own business. Most of the rest of the powers that exist in this country are so atomized and uncoordinated, as well as sclerotic and complacent, that there isn't anything that puts up a resistance to even the rather modest and lethargic power grabs that the justice and defense systems are doing. And then of course there are the American people, who in spite of some fear mongering like we saw after 9/11, don't really accept these things for political or ideological reasons, but just tacitly accept them out of sheer apathy and ignorance.



    That makes want to know; how do the police handle these situations in countries where they do not carry guns?
    Truth to all of the above. Once the police force have serious firepower, they end up using it. Things designed to do something eventually do that thing.

    I wonder that as well. I imagine they just need access to less force.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    How often are crimes committed with that type of weaponry, per jurisdiction? Once a week? Once a year? Once a century? I want data.
    You're asking for justification. It doesn't matter, it's a direct response to possibility. Cause and effect.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    You're asking for justification. It doesn't matter, it's a direct response to possibility. Cause and effect.
    Bull. There's a possibility that an asteroid or comet will strike the Earth, exterminating our civilization. We're not spending trillions to fight that possibility. There are lots of "possibilities" that exist that don't lead to us spending billions of dollars in response. Why does this subject not need justification? What makes this so important in your mind that cost-benefit analysis can be ignored?
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  9. #9
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    Bull. There's a possibility that an asteroid or comet will strike the Earth, exterminating our civilization. We're not spending trillions to fight that possibility. There are lots of "possibilities" that exist that don't lead to us spending billions of dollars in response. Why does this subject not need justification? What makes this so important in your mind that cost-benefit analysis can be ignored?
    I was posting that video to give an explanation as to why our police forces have access to such gear. Most of it is a response to that specific event.

    I'm not going to debate you, because I don't think that way. I'm lest interested in shoulds, and more interested in whys and hows. Once a government bureaucracy has a hold of a budget in the reason for protecting the citizens, the shoulds rarely get revisited unless there's a more ominous event that prompts it.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    I was posting that video to give an explanation as to why our police forces have access to such gear. Most of it is a response to that specific event.

    I'm not going to debate you, because I don't think that way. I'm lest interested in shoulds, and more interested in whys and hows. Once a government bureaucracy has a hold of a budget in the reason for protecting the citizens, the shoulds rarely get revisited unless there's a more ominous event that prompts it.
    You've got the cause and effect completely wrong. The police had been militarizing long before that event. The police have militarized because of the drug war. Drug seizures give them lots of cash to spend on expensive "toys" that they can use to terrorize the citizens (which is what they're doing in Ferguson, Missouri right now).

    Your second paragraph is nonsense. I asked two "why" questions that you have refused to answer in your effort to not have your opinions challenged.

    Why does this subject not need justification? What makes this so important in your mind that cost-benefit analysis can be ignored?
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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