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  1. #41
    The Dark Lord The Wailing Specter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    The Wiki article doesn't say so I assume it wasn't cut off.



    That's exactly right. Entrepreneurship thrives when there are few regulations; under authoritarians like Obama and FDR, entrepreneurship suffers and we see high unemployment (over 90 million unemployed and 48 million on foodstamps), few high paying jobs created, and the lowest home ownership for those 35 yrs and under in recorded history (since 1982).



    I don't doubt this at all. They've been brainwashed to believe in a bunch of lefty nonsense at a very early age.
    You and I have similar views on this matter.
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  2. #42
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    We are entrepreneurs because we have to be. I mean that's what made this country great anyway, but job security as a prole is a hahaha thing of the past for many people, especially if you plan on living above the poverty level.
    I have fantasies about small businesses toppling some of the big baddies.
    I think many Millennials are hard core liberals though so I think you're wrong about that, liberal is the new conservative.
    yes to all of this (frankly, it scares me)
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  3. #43
    Level 8 Propaganda Bot SpankyMcFly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    A lot of the conclusions you are drawing from that are pretty off. That data seems to suggest that the young people are more libertarian than you might think, not more "statist".
    The majority of Americans are social liberals and fiscal conservatives. This is prototypical libertarian (lower case L).

    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    I don't call myself a libertarian because I'm in favor of wealth distribution to some extent.
    There is a right/left wing of Libertarianism. Wealth distribution supporters are left of center (within Libertarianism) and generally have egalitarian views concerning natural resources, believing that it is illegitimate for anyone to claim private ownership of resources to the detriment of others. They support some form of income redistribution on the grounds of a claim by each individual to be entitled to an equal share of natural resources. Left-libertarianism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    If I were an Australian I'd be a member of the Sex Party https://www.sexparty.org.au/ I agree with 90+% of their platform Oh, and they make the BEST commercials... EVER. Go ahead, google a few, they are hilarious by my American standards. They'd never pass muster though in the U.S. because the FCC is pretty conservative and we have too many politically correct people, who I'd LOVE to ship off to another country, if only...

    Here's a sample:




    Thanks @Maddy for introducing me to this wonderful party

    P.S. This party definitely needs to be assimilated into the collective.
    Last edited by SpankyMcFly; 08-14-2014 at 05:04 AM.
    "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents... Some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the light into the peace and safety of a new Dark Age. " - H.P. Lovecraft

  4. #44
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpankyMcFly View Post
    The majority of Americans are social liberals and fiscal conservatives. This is prototypical libertarian (lower case L).



    There is a right/left wing of Libertarianism. Wealth distribution supporters are left of center (within Libertarianism) and generally have egalitarian views concerning natural resources, believing that it is illegitimate for anyone to claim private ownership of resources to the detriment of others. They support some form of income redistribution on the grounds of a claim by each individual to be entitled to an equal share of natural resources. Left-libertarianism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    If I were an Australian I'd be a member of the Sex Party https://www.sexparty.org.au/ I agree with 90+% of their platform Oh, and they make the BEST commercials... EVER. Go ahead, google a few, they are hilarious by my American standards. They'd never pass muster though in the U.S. because the FCC is pretty conservative and we have too many politically correct people, who I'd LOVE to ship off to another country, if only...
    I understand that.

    However, one must, to communicate clearly, use terms by their most commonly understood definition, which in the U.S. refers to a right-libertarian. I support abortions for some, minature American flags for others. Those commercials are better than 100% of American political campaign ads.

    American campaign ads really aren't that far off from this:

    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


    This is not going to go the way you think....

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  5. #45
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    This must be country/culture specific.

  6. #46
    Level 8 Propaganda Bot SpankyMcFly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzy Conduit View Post
    I thought you libertarian types prided themselves on being isolationists. That tends to be a big talking point in Libertarian candidates' talking points, does it not?
    Thought I'd chime in as a card carrying Libertarian . I'd rephrase that to say "non-interventionist". The difference is important as isolationist is often a pejorative. Isolationists don't want free market trade (national protectionism i.e. tariffs on Chinese goods anyone? ), are usually anti immigration and are anti-war. Isolationism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia vs. Non-interventionism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    A Pew Research Poll done in Dec. 2013: "...52 percent of the public thinks the United States should mind its own business internationally. That is the highest number recorded in response to a question pollsters have been asking since 1964. A decade ago only about one-in-three Americans said the United States should mind its own business abroad." ~ Aka non-interventionism.

    Commentary by James M. Lindsay and Rachael Kauss of the Council on Foreign Relations | Pew Research Center for the People and the Press
    "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents... Some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the light into the peace and safety of a new Dark Age. " - H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpankyMcFly View Post
    Thought I'd chime in as a card carrying Libertarian . I'd rephrase that to say "non-interventionist". The difference is important as isolationist is often a pejorative. Isolationists don't want free market trade (national protectionism i.e. tariffs on Chinese goods anyone? ), are usually anti immigration and are anti-war. Isolationism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia vs. Non-interventionism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    A Pew Research Poll done in Dec. 2013: "...52 percent of the public thinks the United States should mind its own business internationally. That is the highest number recorded in response to a question pollsters have been asking since 1964. A decade ago only about one-in-three Americans said the United States should mind its own business abroad." ~ Aka non-interventionism.

    Commentary by James M. Lindsay and Rachael Kauss of the Council on Foreign Relations | Pew Research Center for the People and the Press
    cool story bro

  8. #48
    Senior Member tinker683's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    1. Millennials prefer smaller government, if larger government requires high taxes.
    Not necessarily. I want a "smart" government, one that is fiscally responsible. The last "small" government administration we had spent money like it grew on trees. I'm not opposed to an increase in taxes if it makes sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    2. Millennials are cautious of government power
    Yes, I am. Both sides of the aisle have demonstrated to me to a severe lack of foresight when it comes to yielding the power of the federal government and that's hideously bad to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    3. Millennials still want government to care for the disadvantaged.
    Yes I do

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    4. Millennials strongly prefer free markets over a government-managed economy.
    I almost feel like this is the set up for a false dichotomy but, yes, I do.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    5. Millennials don’t like to be nannied.
    No, I don't, and it's odd to me how many anti-government types deride the government as a "nanny" state whilst expecting it to force everyone to behave the way they want people to act.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    6. Millennials are entrepreneurial and like business.
    I like to think so

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    7. Millennials favor meritocracy over egalitarianism.
    Not at the expense of common sense

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    8. Millennials are social liberals and fiscal centrists.
    That sounds about right

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    9. To stimulate the economy, millennials want action.
    I would prefer a REAL economy than this Keynesian bullshit we're dealing with. I want us to actually PRODUCE something, to have something that says, "American made" and take pride in it, not this constant credit swirl we have now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    10. Millennials are the most racially diverse generation.
    I'm not sure I know what this means and I'm also not sure how it's relevant. It would seem like, if the prior generations before us had a focus on segregation that ended before our generation began, then wouldn't this be the logical outcome of that social movement?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    What this tells me is that millenials aren't tuned in to the economy, to politics and to current events in general. They say they want free markets, but they support policies such as a "living minimum wage". They say they don't want a nanny state but they support the nanny state political party in droves. They say they like business but they support business killing policies like cap and trade. In short, these people (generally speaking) are statists who don't want to be called statists. The only bright spot in this poll are the millennials making $50,000 and more/year. 57% of millenials making over $100,000/year oppose wealth redistribution policies while only 39% of those making less than $20,000 oppose wealth redistribution.
    What are you getting at exactly? What overall point are you trying to shoot for, that millennials are a contradictory bunch? So were my parents (boomers) and my grand parents (the greatest gen). What's your point?
    "The man who is swimming against the stream knows the strength of it."
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  9. #49
    deplorable basketcase Tellenbach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinker683
    What are you getting at exactly? What overall point are you trying to shoot for, that millennials are a contradictory bunch? So were my parents (boomers) and my grand parents (the greatest gen). What's your point?
    This poll reveals a strong ignorance of how the economy works. One can not be an advocate of free market capitalism and support statist policies such as a progressive income tax, the minimum wage, social security, Obamacare, etc. One can not be in support of meritocracy and then support affirmative action and progressive taxes.

    I suspect previous generations were equally ignorant; FDR was a national disaster and those idiots kept voting for him.
    Senator Rand Paul is alive because of modern medicine and because his attacker punches like a girl.

  10. #50
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    This poll reveals a strong ignorance of how the economy works. One can not be an advocate of free market capitalism and support statist policies such as a progressive income tax, the minimum wage, social security, Obamacare, etc. One can not be in support of meritocracy and then support affirmative action and progressive taxes.
    LOL, you're an extremist...and you're wrong.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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