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  1. #21
    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    I can do the research myself, read the sources and come to conclusions. Academics are great at obsfucation and have a mastery of language: they use these to cover up their lack of basic logic. As i have explained before.

    1. God represents the highest possible ideal (perfection).
    2. Therefore anything that comes from Him is perfect also.
    3. (If you are a Muslim) The Quran is perfect.

    Given this, how is it possible to pick and choose bits to believe in from the Quran while being a Muslim? The best aspect of this argument is that it applies to other religions as well.

    By contrast: Any political view (take feminism for example, which kyuuei is alluding to) can evolve, provided the basic principles it is built on aren't violated. The danger of infusing religion with politics is that it then becomes absolute as well.
    The Quran being perfect is not the same as saying the Quran can't be altered. Maybe it was perfect for its generation, or its spirit was perfect, or it's perfect, but it's being interpreted or translated incorrectly. There's nothing illogical about that. In fact, you could even argue that God, making man, made him perfect too, and his interpretations, however illogical, are also perfect.

  2. #22
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsWhatHeSaid View Post
    No it isn't. It's tribalism. Case closed bro.
    Tribalism opens up a whole psychological world.

    And we can start to see tribalism in contrast with the the literate individual.

    So now we have two psychological worlds to compare: the tribe and the literate individual.

    Case opened bro.

  3. #23
    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    Tribalism opens up a whole psychological world.

    And we can start to see tribalism in contrast with the the literate individual.

    So now we have two psychological worlds to compare: the tribe and the literate individual.

    Case opened bro.
    The literate just make sophisticated tribes. They're not beyond tribalism. It's part of our DNA. What's up with the arrogance, bro?

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsWhatHeSaid View Post
    The literate just make sophisticated tribes. They're not beyond tribalism. It's part of our DNA. What's up with the arrogance, bro?
    I have the natural arrogance of a literate individual from an aristocratic culture.

    You could of course take me as a role model and become literate yourself, but alas you will never have the benefit of an aristocratic culture.

    You reveal you are déclassé by calling me bro.

  5. #25
    Nerd King Usurper Edgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    I am waiting for the predictable headline that this is a product of "extremism" and not assimilating immigrants enough is the problem
    Them not assimilating IS the problem. If they assimilated, they'd be too busy munching baguettes and watching shitty new wave films (or whatever it is French people do on a daily basis) instead of trying to come up with inventive ways to blow up kafirs.

    Countries can, and do, flourish with immigration - this is assuming the new arrivals embrace their adopted country instead of trying to undermine it.
    Listen to me, baby, you got to understand, you're old enough to learn the makings of a man.

  6. #26
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    The Islamists tried to blow up our small nuclear plant at Sutherland in New South Wales, but we caught them in time and brought them before our Criminal Courts and they were convicted and remain in jail.

  7. #27
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    Given this, how is it possible to pick and choose bits to believe in from the Quran while being a Muslim? The best aspect of this argument is that it applies to other religions as well.
    Now take a look at history. Christianity has changed tremendously over the centuries while its foundation, the Bible, like the Quran, has stayed the same ever since its completion. How it is possible? Texts are open to interpretation (there is a whole discipline dedicated to it: hermeneutics), and human beings seldom use logic to justify their decisions in life. You seem oddly unaware of human nature for someone who professes to be interested in history and travelling the world; and believing that your argument proves anything about Muslims (or any other people of the book) shows just that.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Adam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    I can do the research myself, read the sources and come to conclusions. Academics are great at obsfucation and have a mastery of language: they use these to cover up their lack of basic logic.
    You are off your rocker. What is basic logic and how do you think you have more of it than the academia?

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Them not assimilating IS the problem. If they assimilated, they'd be too busy munching baguettes and watching shitty new wave films (or whatever it is French people do on a daily basis) instead of trying to come up with inventive ways to blow up kafirs.

    Countries can, and do, flourish with immigration - this is assuming the new arrivals embrace their adopted country instead of trying to undermine it.
    Immigration should always be treated with skepticism and not just assumed to be a good thing. Never embrace change for the sake of change.

    Assimilation still leads to the genetic dilution of a country's people, and this would consequently alter the culture. A people bring their culture with them, so as their proportion of the population grows so does their cultural influence.

    You see assimilation when minorities are too small to exercise much political power as it aids their survival to minimise how much they stand out. This state, however, is not permanent.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam View Post
    You are off your rocker. What is basic logic and how do you think you have more of it than the academia?
    Here's another example: instead of showing me why I am wrong, you just say I am and repeat that until you believe it.

    Because your POV is popular, it is much easier for you to get away with this than it is for me. So here's another logical fallacy; that because lots of people believe something it must be true. And another, that because someone is in a position of authority they must be right.

    Three in one comment

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