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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eluded_One View Post
    When I first read this thread, I thought the same, until I made a better attempt to see it in a woman's perspective. Similar to @Jaguar said, it deals with equal rights issues. However, it goes fairly deeper.
    I didn't say women are wrong for wanting equality. I said I am surprised that women who live in a culture where they feel a real likelihood exists of being victimized would even consider walking around with breasts exposed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eluded_One View Post
    I believe Socrates noted, that the relationship between man and women have the same interest as master and slave. Society should have moved beyond this point by now.

    Breast arousal is mainly due to an evolutionary response, the contrasting scenario can also be undone through evolution.
    But society hasn't moved beyond that point (some would attribute that to evolution, as well); many of the gender norms that men and women continually reinforce serves only to solidify the dominant/submissive dynamic, rather than promote any semblance of equality.

  2. #42
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    Ime, it didnt matter whether i was fully dressed or wearing a bikini to the men who felt entitled to my body in any way - the only difference was that society gave them more of a pass on that kind of behavior the fewer clothes i was wearing and theyd use it to shame you and justify their actions.

    It still didnt stop them from trying to do the same thing when i was dressed from top to bottom - the shaming or the disrespecting of my boundaries.

    In fact, I got told by more than one that they 'approved' of my dress code as most 'western women dressed like whores' (I dress more bohemian), after which they proceeded to ignore my 'no and touch me anyways.

    Desexualizing the naked female body for daring to just be and removing their tools of justification is a big step towards getting that kind of harassment out in the open with nothing to hide behind, imho.

    You don't get any more respect from people like that by putting on more clothes - on the contrary. It just confirms them in their entitled beliefs.
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  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    You don't solve problems by tackling the biggest ones first. Sorry, but usually the proven methods that work show the opposite--baby steps in small directions.

    Yeah, dudes will always look. They certainly did in Uganda. But I noticed--not nearly as much as they would have here in America. They were desensitized to it. Like breast feeding moms and ladies in the jungle were NOT the same as girls shaking it in a club. They were two different sets of boobs. It did not diminish their interest, but it put a realistic, less holy-grail approach to it all. And I found that refreshing.
    *sigh* You have no idea how tired I am of seeing this kind of short-sightedness regarding male sexuality from women.

    Men here automatically get turned on by the sight of bare-breasted women, and I really don't give a damn what they're like in Uganda. Who wants to emulate Uganda? Think about what you are saying...

    It would be brazen feminist social engineering (not to mention a ridiculous waste of time and taxpayers' money) to try and breed out such habits anyway, and ultimately would only succeed in making men ashamed of their sexuality. I get that you hate male sexuality but at the same time want to be able to "express yourself" in any and every way. Fortunately this base selfishness would be impractical to introduce on a massive scale.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    And I'm sure there are some big-breasted women that prefer the support.. But honestly, most women don't truly need it for most activities that aren't plyometrics, work, and physical fitness related. That's a pretty personal choice and, for small breasted women, most of the bra focus is on covering just the nipples so they can't be seen.. the rest of the breast isn't really the concern.
    There seems to be a widespread delusion amongst feminists that men are forcing women to do this or that; in reality, most women are most hesitant sexually than men, and feel quite uncomfortable psychologically being bare-breasted. You can accuse me of merely stating an opinion, but if you asked other women what they thought on this matter, I assure you: you won't find many who want to expose themselves in most situations, save the practical, such as breastfeeding and swimming.

    That you have a contrary opinion is OK. That you want to force it on everyone else merely for ideological reasons is not.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    Men get turned on by the sight of bare-breasted women. You can't breed it out and it nothing less than feminist social engineering (not to mention a ridiculous waste of time and taxpayers' money) to try. I get that you hate male sexuality but at the same time want to be able to "express yourself" in any and every way.

    Fortunately this base selfishness would be impractical to introduce on a massive scale.
    hey...........you know...............women..............get turned on by shirtless dudes too...........surprise!!
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  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chanaynay View Post
    hey...........you know...............women..............get turned on by shirtless dudes too...........surprise!!
    Shoulders....
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  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lexicon View Post
    <gif>

    So slow...

    Quote Originally Posted by 93JC View Post
    <gif>

    Bump!

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullet View Post
    I didn't say women are wrong for wanting equality. I said I am surprised that women who live in a culture where they feel a real likelihood exists of being victimized would even consider walking around with breasts exposed.
    Well, obviously the still far away day/more ideal world when women can walk around topless without a worry presupposes a world where they don't have to fear sexual aggression or slut shaming. The two shifts in society are actually somewhat related.
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  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by 93JC View Post


    Bump!
    hehe "boop"
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  9. #49
    Senior Member Eluded_One's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullet View Post
    I didn't say women are wrong for wanting equality. I said I am surprised that women who live in a culture where they feel a real likelihood exists of being victimized would even consider walking around with breasts exposed.
    I apologize if it seemed like I was correcting you, it wasn't what I was aiming for. Yes, if likelihood would exist, a sex crime spree would be imminent. Which would probably be met with an increase in punishment to related crimes.

    But society hasn't moved beyond that point (some would attribute that to evolution, as well); many of the gender norms that men and women continually reinforce serves only to solidify the dominant/submissive dynamic, rather than promote any semblance of equality.
    Equality is a man made word that can and probably will never measure up to it's own ideals. It's a perpetual conundrum that keeps us moving forward for the benefit of every living person.

    The question is, if you believe the formula has worked thus far, why change it? My answer: because it serves a higher, better purpose.
    “If you worry about what might be, and wonder what might have been, you will ignore what is.” -anonymous

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Herring View Post
    Well, obviously the still far away day/more ideal world when women can walk around topless without a worry presupposes a world where they don't have to fear sexual aggression or slut shaming. The two shifts in society are actually somewhat related.
    A small and very vocal minority of women, who claim to speak for all of them, are pushing for this. I find it laughable that a majority of women want to walk around topless or would even support such activity being legalised.

    How retarded are you all not to understand that men just find breasts hot. Don't like us staring? Cover them up!!!

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