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  1. #61
    Senior Member OptoGypsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chanaynay View Post
    I usually stay away from topics like these because I never want to touch a gun ever and I haven't really decided my stance on guns, but here's my $0.02.

    I dunno. It's hard to say for me. Having a gun in my own house to keep myself and my family protected does sound nice, but at the same time if everyone had a gun in their home the perpetrators would just be that much more prepared for whatever they were planning on doing.

    Also, this would mean that ANYONE would be able to access a gun. I'm already pretty paranoid myself, and the rate of mass shootings in America has been increasing iirc, so I'm not sure how comfortable I'd feel if I knew every citizen I pass by owns a gun. I'm already pretty suspicious of people around me for no reason (damn 6 wing) so giving all of these people a gun just puts me off. Not that the whole country has to cater to my feelings or whatever. But I mean if the Newtown shooter took guns from his mom then I dunno...it could create a lot of chaos. It's easy to conceal a shotgun in, say, a car. It just seems like enabling a bunch of other people to cause damage. And if these are exclusive to homes then there's no hope for people that didn't bring concealed handguns with them. But concealed handguns seems even worse, enabling more rapists, robbers, etc.

    It's a big conundrum.
    @Amargith @SpankyMcFly @johnnyyukon @kyuuei @Southern Kross could someone provide insight please?
    It's A Fucking Paradox but what it comes down to is that guns don't make people want to murder someone nor do movies, video games, music etc. Humans make Humans want to murder Humans that and self pity...

  2. #62
    untitled Chanaynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OptoGypsy View Post
    It's A Fucking Paradox but what it comes down to is that guns don't make people want to murder someone nor do movies, video games, music etc. Humans make Humans want to murder Humans that and self pity...
    This effectively answers nothing but alright.
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  3. #63
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chanaynay View Post
    It's a big conundrum could someone provide insight please?
    OK, to give you two recent example in Canberra, the Capital of Australia.

    After legally entering a home the other day the police found two unregistered pistols. This is illegal. So the pistols were confiscated and the owners charged under the law. Also this together with a picture of the pistols made the front page of the Canberra Times newspaper.

    The second instance, again just the other day, the police legally pulled up a car on the highway and found an unregistered shotgun inside. So the police confiscated the shotgun and charged the owner under the law. This was again publicized in the Canberra Times.

  4. #64
    untitled Chanaynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    OK, to give you two recent example in Canberra, the Capital of Australia.

    After legally entering a home the other day the police found two unregistered pistols. This is illegal. So the pistols were confiscated and the owners charged under the law. Also this together with a picture of the pistols made the front page of the Canberra Times newspaper.

    The second instance, again just the other day, the police legally pulled up a car on the highway and found an unregistered shotgun inside. So the police confiscated the shotgun and charged the owner under the law. This was again publicized in the Canberra Times.
    Groundbreaking.
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  5. #65
    Senior Member OptoGypsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chanaynay View Post
    This effectively answers nothing but alright.
    The question isn't if there are guns or aren't guns people are going to always find a way to murder people with or without guns, there are always explosives, construction tools, hand-made guns etc. People will murder one another regardless if there are guns so my question to you are you paranoid about guns or other human beings? Is the problem with guns?

  6. #66
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chanaynay View Post
    It's hard to say for me. Having a gun in my own house to keep myself and my family protected does sound nice, but at the same time if everyone had a gun in their home the perpetrators would just be that much more prepared for whatever they were planning on doing.
    Living in a culture of extreme individuality Americans naturally make the mistake of thinking that guns are a matter of personal choice.

    But the fact is that gun culture is a social issue and cannot be solved on the individual level but only on the social level. So gun culture can only be resolved by a broad democratic social movement. The great American, Meryl Streep, is starting such a democratic movement.

    So in discussing guns Americans make a category mistake: they put guns in the personal category when they are in the social category.

  7. #67
    untitled Chanaynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OptoGypsy View Post
    The question isn't if there are guns or aren't guns people are going to always find a way to murder people with or without guns, there are always explosives, construction tools, hand-made guns etc. People will murder one another regardless if there are guns so my question to you are you paranoid about guns or other human beings? Is the problem with guns?
    I'm pretty sure it's guns.

    But I can obviously tell what agenda you're coming from and just trying to advance it so goodbye.
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  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by OptoGypsy View Post
    Is the problem with guns?
    Yes, because guns are designed to kill the largest number of people in the shortest period of time.

    But none of this will change until the gun culture changes, and this requires a broad social movement.

  9. #69
    untitled Chanaynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    Living in a culture of extreme individuality Americans naturally make the mistake of thinking that guns are a matter of personal choice.

    But the fact is that gun culture is a social issue and cannot be solved on the individual level but only on the social level. So gun culture can only be resolved by a broad democratic social movement. The great American, Meryl Streep, is starting such a democratic movement.

    So in discussing guns Americans make a category mistake: they put guns in the personal category when they are in the social category.


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  10. #70
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chanaynay View Post
    I dunno. It's hard to say for me. Having a gun in my own house to keep myself and my family protected does sound nice, but at the same time if everyone had a gun in their home the perpetrators would just be that much more prepared for whatever they were planning on doing.
    I find this a bit of a fallacy.. I mean, technically 90% of the people you know currently DO have access to guns. They can go out, get one, and have it right now. They choose not to most of the time, but they have access for sure. Even if all of them bought guns, perps would do what they always do. Crime goes on, with guns or without.. the statistics don't add up to it all. I'm not convinced banning all guns stops gun violence. Nor am I convinced that having guns curbs gun violence. I can only speak on my personal opinion and experience.. and in that experience, I felt less safe and had more scary situations in areas and situations where the people I knew did not have at least one person with a weapon on them at all times. I grew up around them, seeing them, and it wasn't a big deal. Respect comes with it all.

    I mean if the Newtown shooter took guns from his mom then I dunno...it could create a lot of chaos. It's easy to conceal a shotgun in, say, a car. It just seems like enabling a bunch of other people to cause damage. And if these are exclusive to homes then there's no hope for people that didn't bring concealed handguns with them. But concealed handguns seems even worse, enabling more rapists, robbers, etc.
    I have a feeling robbers and rapists don't bother to get CHLs, for what it's worth.. but the REAL issue behind that kid stealing his mother's weapons is a lack of accountability. If it were up to me, there'd be far stricter laws on accountability than there would be on trying to keep guns regulated any other way. In the military, if you went more than arm's length from your weapon and it wasn't tied up or you didn't actively ask someone to watch it, your ass was grass. If civilians took that level of respect and responsibility seriously, there wouldn't be kids stealing guns. Lock it up (and I don't mean stick it in a drawer (though I do caveat that if you're sleeping you could have it in the drawer beside you in your house), or carry it on you. If we were allowed to carry it openly, so people could see, but also have accountability constantly that way, no one who purchased a gun would have it stolen. So far as I'm concerned, if you have weapons and a safe that isn't bolted down and it's stolen, you're just as responsible. You better make that robber work for that weapon way harder than he'd ever desire.

    I'm just the opposite as you though.. I feel more comforted seeing people carrying weapons. I dislike a crowd of people uneducated about weapons, just lazing through life, and the second someone pulls a box cutter out of their pocket they all go bananas.

    Terrible things are going to happen... Whether we take everyone's guns away or not. Whether we limit types of guns or not. I can't deny that, and I don't think anyone will. But I also know that criminals tend to go about things the illegal way either way.. while having a system that allows guns certainly makes it easier, it's easier for alcoholics to get alcohol and ruin their families lives and I'm not calling for prohibition to start again anytime soon.
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