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  1. #61
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    What is the connection between blood and land?
    I was interested to hear that explanation also.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


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  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    I was interested to hear that explanation also.
    If you can't already recognise it there's no point in explaining it.

  3. #63
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    If you can't already recognise it there's no point in explaining it.
    It doesn't make sense to me because my ancestors come from all over. Sure, I could emigrate to where they came from, but if everyone held to that mentality, I'd be an outsider. And there's also the fact that at one point, my ancestors used to live somewhere else. Sure, it was Ireland at one point, but people didn't always live in Ireland. And were they Celts, or Norsemen? I dunno.

    Human populations migrate all the time, it's really nothing new. Are you certain that your ancestors lived within the same swath of land delineated by your national borders 2000 years ago? Are you certain that someone else didn't live there before then?
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


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  4. #64
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    If you can't already recognise it there's no point in explaining it.
    This doesn't support your argument though, and doesn't lend to anyone taking your stance on this seriously. I think I know what your talking about; that there is a genetic basis to race and native population to an area. Correct me if I am wrong on that. The thing is though, that's really not a strong argument at all, because that alone doesn't really matter much. What does matter (as I have pointed out in the past) is culture, which can be independent of the genetic history of a land.
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  5. #65
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    This doesn't support your argument though, and doesn't lend to anyone taking your stance on this seriously. I think I know what your talking about; that there is a genetic basis to race and native population to an area. Correct me if I am wrong on that. The thing is though, that's really not a strong argument at all, because that alone doesn't really matter much. What does matter (as I have pointed out in the past) is culture, which can be independent of the genetic history of a land.
    He doesn't really know how long his genetic line has even been in that particular land, I suspect. I really only know for certain with mine only 4 generations, and sometimes not even then. Perhaps he knows more, but I'd be willing to bet that he doesn't even know 1000 years ago.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


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  6. #66
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    He doesn't really know how long his genetic line has even been in that particular land, I suspect. I really only know for certain with mine only 4 generations, and sometimes not even then. Perhaps he knows more, but I'd be willing to bet that he doesn't even know 1000 years ago.
    Yeah, it's a moot point in regards to who really "owns" something unless it goes way, way back, and even then it's very often incidental. I actually know my family history quite a ways back, but after 6 generations people get lost in the cracks here and there (and it begins to add up) due to lack of good recorded history. I got my genome (part of it) sequenced through 23andme last year and they went through and labeled your genetic background, and even with the most modern methods it's really fuzzy to say where exactly you're from on that alone.
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  7. #67
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    Yeah, it's a moot point in regards to who really "owns" something unless it goes way, way back, and even then it's very often incidental. I actually know my family history quite a ways back, but after 6 generations people get lost in the cracks here and there (and it begins to add up) due to lack of good recorded history. I got my genome (part of it) sequenced through 23andme last year and they went through and labeled your genetic background, and even with the most modern methods it's really fuzzy to say where exactly you're from on that alone.
    I've read that most people turn out to be mongrels with that kind of thing, anyway. Just farther back.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


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  8. #68
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    Say, you look as if you might have a little Cro Magnon in you. No? Well, would you like some?

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    This doesn't support your argument though, and doesn't lend to anyone taking your stance on this seriously. I think I know what your talking about; that there is a genetic basis to race and native population to an area. Correct me if I am wrong on that. The thing is though, that's really not a strong argument at all, because that alone doesn't really matter much. What does matter (as I have pointed out in the past) is culture, which can be independent of the genetic history of a land.
    If there is a genetic basis to race and ethnicity, and ethnic groups have lived in an area for a long time uninterrupted (around a thousand years or more probably), they deserve the title of indigenous, because they will have created the main culture associated with that country. If you change the genetic composition of the country's inhabitants, the culture will change, too.

  10. #70
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    I've read that most people turn out to be mongrels with that kind of thing, anyway. Just farther back.
    If you go back far enough everyone comes from africa. 23andme has a time scale for what they scan for, and for some individuals it's more challenging to go back that far. As an example, my maternal haplogroup (mitochondria DNA; inherited from your mothers mothers mothers ad nauseum) is V, which is one of the "newest" haplogroups, and first originated in the Basque region around 80,000 years ago (I might be off on that number by a bit) and then quickly migrated to northern scandanavia. It really just matters when and how you frame it, which again sort of makes a moot argument for "blood" in that sense.
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