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  1. #91
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    And just because one uses the word "scientific", it doesn't necessarily mean "scientifically valid". It could just mean "related to science".

    I found it interesting especially in relation to environmental population dynamics, which I have studied in some depth; IMO, it's an interesting science-related observation. I don't think either of us has the knowledge or resources at hand to decide whether it is valid or not.
    Actually, no, it's incredibly easy to dismiss as unscientific, in any of the senses you use.
    All one requires is a modicum of logic.
    Unfortunately, few of the article's readers appear to have much of that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  2. #92
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    Actually, no, it's incredibly easy to dismiss as unscientific, in any of the senses you use.
    All one requires is a modicum of logic.
    Unfortunately, few of the article's readers appear to have much of that.
    Regardless of what you think, it is by definition science-related. Social inequality is a subject within the scope of the social sciences. I could question your lack of logic on that point.

    Moreover, the argument I'm making has little to do with the scientificness of the article. For me the premise of the article - that social inequality may always exist, and that lower classes always make up the majority - underscores the importance of advocating better living conditions for all people.

    Personally, I think it would be a better use of your time to demonstrate why you think what you think, rather than making sardonic comments that are more likely to upset people than to change their point of view.

  3. #93
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    I wasn't insulting you. (Take a breath!) Just stating the facts.
    Meanwhile, you feel qualified to dismiss me as unqualified to pass judgement, despite knowing nothing whatsoever about my background. Which is pretty arrogant. But I let it pass.

    The "argument" has already been trashed. Perhaps you weren't paying attention.
    If you find it interesting, good for you. I find it perhaps the stupidest and most irresponsible thing I've seen referred to as "science" this year. Which is quite the distinction.

    When I said it was unfortunate that few of the article's readers have the (really very basic level of) logic necessary to write it off as the nonsense it is, I wasn't being sardonic. It really is unfortunate that many more people are persuaded by credentials than can be bothered to critically evaluate arguments. I wasn't including you amongst those.

    Words. I hate 'em.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    I wasn't insulting you. (Take a breath!) Just stating the facts.
    Meanwhile, you feel qualified to dismiss me as unqualified to pass judgement, despite knowing nothing whatsoever about my background. Which is pretty arrogant. But I let it pass.

    The "argument" has already been trashed. Perhaps you weren't paying attention.
    If you find it interesting, good for you. I find it perhaps the stupidest and most irresponsible thing I've seen referred to as "science" this year. Which is quite the distinction.

    When I said it was unfortunate that few of the article's readers have the (really very basic level of) logic necessary to write it off as the nonsense it is, I wasn't being sardonic. It really is unfortunate that many more people are persuaded by credentials than can be bothered to critically evaluate arguments. I wasn't including you amongst those.

    Words. I hate 'em.
    I think perhaps we are having a miscommunication here. I find you unqualified only to pass judgment on the quality of my thinking, because you seem to have misunderstood my train of thought: I wasn't addressing the scientificness of the article. I was just commenting that to me it is interesting in relation to what I have learned primarily in science classes at school. Hence using the word "science". To me it is frustrating that you quickly assumed that I was making a point that I wasn't, and then you questioned my logic on the basis of that, and then you grouped me along with many others who you also felt were making poor judgments. Through my eyes, none of that was really merited. Admittedly, my wording was not the best, but it seemed to me like an overly swift judgment of the quality of my thinking on your part.

    From other things you've written on the forum I actually find you quite intelligent and I feel confident that you are capable of making high-level, coherent judgments on this topic.

  5. #95
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    All I took issue with was your characterisation of the paper/article as "a good scientific point".
    It isn't. Objectively, it isn't. Your opinion has no bearing on that.
    The rest is a figment of your fevered imagination and I'm not going to pacify you in this tantrum you want to throw.

    Back to regularly scheduled programming...
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  6. #96
    Honor Thy Inferior Such Irony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    Even if social inequality is natural, and that natural aspect of it is something of merit, it's equally natural that we resist and overcome it. So it seems foolish to venerate it or use that as an excuse to get a leg up on the disenfranchised.

    Sums up my thoughts.
    Good point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Herring View Post
    I wanna move to Norway.

    The high degree of inequality in the U.S. disturbs me but at least we're not the worst in this regard.
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  7. #97
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Such Irony View Post
    Good point.



    I wanna move to Norway.

    The high degree of inequality in the U.S. disturbs me but at least we're not the worst in this regard.
    Is there some common denominator to explain why some countries have lower rates of inequality? Also, what color would have been assigned to the US 60 years ago?
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  8. #98
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Personally, I don't think an *equal* sharing of income is necessary or desirable, even if it were possible, but I don't think the huge chasm we now have between those at the top and the rest of us is necessary or desirable, either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Personally, I don't think an *equal* sharing of income is necessary or desirable, even if it were possible, but I don't think the huge chasm we now have between those at the top and the rest of us is necessary or desirable, either.
    I'm not advocating for *total* equality. I'm okay with some diversity in income. For example, a lawyer or doctor working a grueling 80 hour week in a high-stress job requiring intensive training should earn more than the average. On the other hand, there are people like professional athletes and famous celebrities who make multi-millions a year, way more money than they would ever need in a lifetime to live comfortably and then some. Then you have people who can barely make ends meet even though they are working hard to better themselves. Yes there are lazy people out there who will take advantage of welfare and government freebies but in general I think most people want to make a real contribution to society and do meaningful work and feel like they earn what they make.
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  10. #100
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Such Irony View Post
    I'm not advocating for *total* equality. I'm okay with some diversity in income. For example, a lawyer or doctor working a grueling 80 hour week in a high-stress job requiring intensive training should earn more than the average. On the other hand, there are people like professional athletes and famous celebrities who make multi-millions a year, way more money than they would ever need in a lifetime to live comfortably and then some. Then you have people who can barely make ends meet even though they are working hard to better themselves. Yes there are lazy people out there who will take advantage of welfare and government freebies but in general I think most people want to make a real contribution to society and do meaningful work and feel like they earn what they make.
    I agree with everything you've said here, and I didn't think you were advocating for total equality. I was more pointing out how using the "study" in the OP as a means to conclude that oh well, our system of wealth being increasingly concentrated in hands of a very few who coincidentally have the power to set the rules is physics now, is fallacious. Very, very few people are advocating for *total* equality, so the fact that total equality is unlikely to be sustainable is irrelevant.

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