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  1. #321
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyyukon View Post
    Interesting that you were actually the first one to bring it up.

    Yesterday 02:12 PM


    Today 03:00 PM


    Today 05:14 PM


    Did you learn logic and debate from a pop-up book? I'll return to this thread when your nonsensical posts are gone.
    I'd say you are great at playing dense, but I don't know if it's truly an act.

  2. #322
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    I'm not saying this as a mod/admin since I've been personally involved in the thread and we try not to do mod stuff in threads where we've been participating, but seriously, I could do without the back and forth that has taken over. This topic has been weighing heavily on me all week and I'd love to discuss it civilly with you guys but this is just tiresome.

  3. #323
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    I'd say you are great at playing dense, but I don't know if it's truly an act.
    I don't mind people throwing around insults as long as they're coupled with some substance. You're missing the substance here.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  4. #324
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I'm not saying this as a mod/admin since I've been personally involved in the thread and we try not to do mod stuff in threads where we've been participating, but seriously, I could do without the back and forth that has taken over. This topic has been weighing heavily on me all week and I'd love to discuss it civilly with you guys but this is just tiresome.
    Noted and apologies.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    I don't mind people throwing around insults as long as they're coupled with some substance. You're missing the substance here.
    I really don't think this point is worthy of any further consideration, as it continues to derail this thread; so responding with any type of "substance" to the "debate" of who derailed the thread and how is ridiculous and irrelevant. I'm done.

  5. #325
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildflower View Post
    that is weird. isn't she legally obligated to call the police?
    Yes (My wife is becoming a psychological counselor, and they can be held partly responsible if they don't report it. What a double bind that must be).

    Quote Originally Posted by Noll View Post
    I don't know how relevant all of you find this, but I find it relevant. One of my favorite YouTubers.

    I go along with this. I'm seeing bloggers now go after "nerds" or more passive guys who ask "why girls don't like the nice guys" with all this tough talk, saying he only needed to "grow up" (which to me insinuates that any such guy who feels resentment regarding poor luck with women has the same problem. It's obviously something much more than that).
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  6. #326
    Sweet Ocean Cloud SD45T-2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    My point was that if the law enforcement officials called to investigate Rodger had taken his threats as seriously as they take threats from other types of terrorists, the ensuing violence could have been avoided. If they'd reviewed the material reported to them properly, if they'd searched his apartment and found his weapons stash and "manifesto" they would surely have had grounds to detain him or monitor his activity at the very least.
    You clearly do not understand how law enforcement works. My best friend on the other hand, has actual law enforcement experience:

    Quote Originally Posted by My best friend
    We are now entering the "Why didn't the cops DO SOMETHING?!?" phase
    regarding the Santa Barbara shooter, in the media and online. So, here
    is EXACTLY what would transpire if Elliot Roger were a [my city]
    resident and his parents called 911 after hearing about his Facebook
    postings:

    Dispatch: Paul 34, Paul 48, welfare check.
    7P34: 34.
    Dispatch: R/P lives in another jurisdiction, states her son who is a
    [my city] resident is posting on Facebook that he wants to kill
    people...wants him placed on 5150 hold.
    7P34: Did you run the son out?
    Dispatch: Affirm, he's clear all systems and valid.
    7P34: Do we have any prior calls at the son's address?
    Dispatch: None in the last 90 days, do you want me to go back further?
    7P34: Negative, I'll advise on cover.
    Dispatch: Copy, Paul 48, you can cancel.

    Officer goes to the residence, kid is perfectly calm, probably says he
    just posted some stuff online while he was upset. He cannot be placed on
    a 5150 hold (which is only 72 hours) under those circumstances. Can't
    enter and take his guns without a warrant, which a judge would have to
    sign. No PC for a search.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    I think most reasonable people would view that as a justified intervention on the part of a public service paid to "protect and serve" rather than a dystopian nightmare of state thought-control...but this is America- you never can tell.
    The opinion of "most reasonable people" is irrelevant. Cops cannot legally do that without sufficient PC or a search warrant.
    1w2-6w5-3w2 so/sp

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  7. #327
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD45T-2 View Post
    You clearly do not understand how law enforcement works. The opinion of "most reasonable people" is irrelevant. Cops cannot legally do that without sufficient PC or a search warrant.
    Here in Oz guns are illegal so the police would have cause to search to find the guns and confiscate them and charge the perpetrator, before he had a chance to commit mass murder.

  8. #328
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD45T-2 View Post
    You clearly do not understand how law enforcement works. My best friend on the other hand, has actual law enforcement experience:



    The opinion of "most reasonable people" is irrelevant. Cops cannot legally do that without sufficient PC or a search warrant.
    Phone in an anonymous tip that he's dealing marijuana or running a meth lab and SWAT would be swarming his place.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  9. #329
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyyukon View Post
    "Domestic terrorism" means activities with the following three characteristics:

    • Involve acts dangerous to human life that violate federal or state law;

    •Appear intended
    (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
    (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
    (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination. or kidnapping; and

    • Occur primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the U.S.


    This definition, Rodgers, not a terrorist.

    And btw, Timothy McVeigh, lone white man, universally accepted as a terrorist.

    I'm curious how your own country defines terrorism.

    And please, continue to go slow, it's always difficult to make sense of people who are already bigoted against America and like to nitpick over semantics.
    Thank you. This is what happens when people get wrapped around the axle about labels. Murder is a crime. Whatever label you want to apply to the murderers, you catch them, prosecute them, then punish them. It's not that complicated. I think we would do much better against the stereotypical terrorists if we treated them as the common criminals they are. The terrorist label serves only to hold the spotlight on them, and give them the publicity they crave. Of course doing this requires we respond rationally to incidents of violence, however motivated and perpetrated, and resist catering to the unfortunate American desire for journalistic titillation.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  10. #330
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Thank you. This is what happens when people get wrapped around the axle about labels. Murder is a crime. Whatever label you want to apply to the murderers, you catch them, prosecute them, then punish them. It's not that complicated. I think we would do much better against the stereotypical terrorists if we treated them as the common criminals they are. The terrorist label serves only to hold the spotlight on them, and give them the publicity they crave. Of course doing this requires we respond rationally to incidents of violence, however motivated and perpetrated, and resist catering to the unfortunate American desire for journalistic titillation.
    Terrorism is also motivated by an ideology. This is why killing terrorists is not a sufficient condition to defeat terrorism. To defeat terrorism it is primarily important to defeat the ideology.

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