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  1. #11
    Ginkgo
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    Quote Originally Posted by senza tema View Post
    But it sure beats being judged on the way you look by the actual police.
    I'm just going to put this here...


  2. #12
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by senza tema View Post
    That doesn't mean the concept itself doesn't have some truth to it.
    I never claimed it didn't.....in practice, however, promotion of the concept (as with Marxism, Objectivism, and all conflict theories) tends to skew and obscure more than it illuminates, and usually leads to counterproductive efforts and outcomes.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    I never claimed it didn't.....in practice, however, promotion of the concept (as with Marxism, Objectivism, and all conflict theories) tends to skew and obscure more than it illuminates, and usually leads to counterproductive efforts and outcomes.
    Yeah, I largely agree with this. I still don't think shutting down dialogue along these avenues is helpful though. If a concept has some validity and targets important issues, it should continue to be considered, discussed and critiqued ... not dismissed wholesale.

  4. #14
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by senza tema View Post
    Yeah, I largely agree with this. I still don't think shutting down dialogue along these avenues is helpful though. If a concept has some validity and targets important issues, it should continue to be considered, discussed and critiqued ... not dismissed wholesale.
    Fair enough, and I agree with you in principle, though I admit I sometimes fail to remember the concept in practice (which would, of course, be predicted by the theory)

  5. #15
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    I read this. I kind of felt solidarity with his frustration. I remember in high school when I had about the same grades and extracurriculars as another girl, except she was a minority, and when we applied for scholarships she got ridiculous amounts of money and was eligible for all sorts of help. Her family lives in the same area as mine; we're financially quite similar. There wasn't really any good reason she should have gotten more so much more money than me besides her ethnic background. It made me really angry that people perceived that she'd worked so much harder than me and deserved more than me because she came from a "less privileged" background... even though her family had nicer cars than mine. My grandparents were not-too-long-ago immigrants mostly from relatively poor areas of Europe and struggled a lot to get here and make it here, so it's not even like her family suffered copious amounts more than mine in the past. It just didn't seem fair.

    At the same time, the writer does totally miss that even though his family background might have had its share of struggles, he benefits in small ways in the day-to-day by being a white male.

    I think he's ballsy to have written it. I like how much fire he put into it. And obviously I agree that it's not really fair to draw a direct line between ethnic background and success. It's more complicated than that. It's kind of funny though that it demonstrates the "blindness" of privilege - he doesn't see what other people are talking about.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    I'm just going to put this here...

    Damn.

  6. #16
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    I don't get into a lot of discussions about things where privilege.comes into play so I don't think I've ever been told to check my Privilege nor have I've ever said that to anyone elae
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  7. #17
    Senior Member BlackDog's Avatar
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    I have never been told this. But I live in the south. If you live in an environment where people tell you to check your privilege, that's sufficient proof that it doesn't exist. If you really had privilege, your background would make you unassailable.

    If you don't believe me, imagine an African-American saying this to a white male in the south in the 60's. It wouldn't make any sense to them because the white male would probably be like, "Yes, I'm privileged, and that's how it should be." Or some such reply. Because that was the belief. That was the first phase.

    Second phase is what the south has now, where people think that privilege can't be expressed openly because in theory it shouldn't exist, but it does, so no one talks about it at all. Because it's embarrassing.

    Third phase is when privilege doesn't exist. People are now on an equal footing, so minorities can express bitterness over the past discrimination (check your privilege) freely. That in itself suggests they can do so without repercussion, or significant repercussion. Which means that privilege is on the decline, or totally absent.

    Make sense?

    No, I'm not judging certain minorities for being somewhat angry over the legacy of discrimination.

    Also, I think that I probably do still have privilege living where I do. But I don't think someone at Princeton with my same background has privilege. Maybe twenty years ago, but not now.

    The dominant ethnic group will never be told to 'check privilege' because if that happens, it indicates they are no longer in control, and not on the main receiving end of privilege. 'Check your privilege' is just an indication that white males have lost power in the Northeast. At least in academic circles like Princeton. If white males were really in control, they would stifle criticism of themselves. That's just how life works. Not saying I endorse that, but I don't think ethnic groups are capable of altruism.

  8. #18
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    People can argue all day long about whether some are priveldged and some are not. Fact is, its not constructive to do so. What does it change? What do you hope to change? People who complain about others priviledge aerent accomplsihing anything. And dont give me the whole "theres nothing you can do to change the fact you're poor/unhappy/unsuccesful" because it is not true, and even if it were, complaining doesnt solve the problem.

    Also, I think the article does a good job at pointing out that things aerent easy, just because you're of European descent. Its hard for everyone. Its time all humans got accustomed to it.

  9. #19
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Just so you all know that this rebuttal happened.

    I was just talking to someone about privilege discussions on the internet. It's tough because on the one side are people who are offended that people seem to be invalidating their experiences, and/or threatening their sense of worth in some way? As if they have less of a voice than everyone else. And on the other side you have people who seem incapable of holding in how angry they are at what they perceive to be the belligerent ignorance of that first group. It doesn't help that the blogosphere and Tumblr seem to be the places where this debate has flourished most, in the past few years. There's no regulation re: keeping that anger in check. So now both sides think the other side is overly belligerent and too emotional to reason with.

    Anyway, while the rebuttal I linked does fall into the pissed-off trap a few times, it's much less condescending and much more clear than other equivalent articles I've recently found.
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  10. #20
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    I'd love to see every person on this planet who lives on less than $2 per day get internet access and constantly stop any person in America who's ever said "check your privilege" from voicing their opinion.

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