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  1. #21
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OWK View Post
    Gun usage conveys no risk in my life. I understand them. I understand their use, and I store them securely.

    I own power tools that are far more dangerous.

    And insofar as "holocaust 2" is concerned... The combined number of innocent men women and children slaughtered by their own government in just the last 100 years, is in the 100's of millions.

    Each of them allowed themselves to be disarmed by their government, because they were convinced by the idea that "it cannot happen here".

    I'm sure each of them had a terminal look of shock in their eyes as they were bulldozed into their mass graves.

    I'll take the "risks" of gun ownership, thanks just the same.
    Somehow I accidentally deleted my post, sorry.

    If the risk is real in your life, and you keep your gun safe, it's all good.

    But I feel like there are a lot of really insulated gun owners sitting on their asses in their very safe suburban homes with their guns unlocked and loaded with essentially zero danger of ever actually benefiting from owning a gun.

  2. #22
    Senior Member OWK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    But I feel like there are a lot of really insulated gun owners sitting on their asses in their very safe suburban homes with their guns unlocked and loaded with essentially zero danger of ever actually benefiting from owning a gun.
    Firearms are tools. They are tools whose primary purpose is prophylactic. (which is to say that they are owned in order to prevent some event which may befall the owner in the future).

    That event may never come to pass. And if it does not, and the owner manages his tools responsibly, no harm done.

    But if that future event comes to pass, and the person is not prepared by owning the proper tool... his person, family, and property are in jeopardy... and he is at the mercy of his assailant.

    I see it as incumbent on me to provide for the security of myself and my family. That is my responsibility. And no one else can fulfill it. The police certainly cannot. They don't prevent crimes... they don't stop crimes... they come to crime scene after the fact, and write reports about crimes.

    And as for needing to protect yourself against future encroachments by the state.. it remains to be seen how effective firearms ownership will be. There are considerable efforts underway to prohibit firearms ownership by law. I take some measure of comfort in knowing that most of the people who like me, disagree with those efforts.. are already armed.

  3. #23
    Senior Member OWK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrderOfTheCaelifera View Post
    It is so, because those of us willing to do whatever necessary to defend the US Constitution are well aware of who's pulling the puppet strings.
    Choose the most obvious of assaults on the Constitution... The assault on the 2nd amendment.

    For decades, the government has encroached upon the second amendment. It has added countless requirements, limitations, regulations, licensing mandates, registrations, at all levels of government.

    Each of these is an infringement.. each has come slowly.. incrementally.. drip, drip, drip... Slow enough, that they are gradually accepted as the norm by each successive generation.

    There is almost no real attention paid to the Constitutional limits on government any more.

    And sadly... no one seems to be coming to its defense.

  4. #24
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    For those of you who think it is worthwhile to own a gun or a collection of them and possibly other weaponry, what about the fact that you have to register stuff and then they know you have it and can come take it away whenever they want?

    Quote Originally Posted by OrderOfTheCaelifera View Post
    It might be a pretend right in your mind but our right to bear arms isn't an illusion (except to Progressive Liberals), some states retain the right to revolt against tyrannical government.
    Were government to attack the US Constitution, politicians will have sentenced themselves to being prisoners of their tyranny, because it won't ever be safe for them to step outside.

    See how many state retain the right to Revolt.
    We own the government, politicians exist to serve us "We the people". "We the people" don't & never will exist to serve the god damn government. We really don't need them, they're dime a dozen puppets & thousands are more than willing to take their place.
    The government has already attacked the Constitution. Some people have said there is no law stating that you have to pay your taxes, yet we are forced to. The power structure has already stripped away many basic rights in the Constitution. The thing is, most people are brainwashed into thinking it's necessary or they don't care, or they are oblivious.

    I am too cynical to think we could really revolt successfully any time soon, and meanwhile they are becoming more and more paternalistic and intrusive. Plus, even if the people were to revolt it would take something different for state governments to follow.

  5. #25
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Can they take weapons away whenever they want? Im not even sure but s
    even if they could, when push comes to shove, why would someone who arms themselves against the government allow their weapons to be taken away without a fight? Kinda like Waco.

  6. #26
    Senior Member OWK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    For those of you who think it is worthwhile to own a gun or a collection of them and possibly other weaponry, what about the fact that you have to register stuff and then they know you have it and can come take it away whenever they want?
    MOLON LABE

  7. #27
    Sweet Ocean Cloud SD45T-2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OWK View Post
    Firearms are tools. They are tools whose primary purpose is prophylactic. (which is to say that they are owned in order to prevent some event which may befall the owner in the future).
    I tend to think of them as being in roughly the same category as smoke alarms and fire extinguishers.

    Quote Originally Posted by OWK
    That event may never come to pass. And if it does not, and the owner manages his tools responsibly, no harm done.

    But if that future event comes to pass, and the person is not prepared by owning the proper tool... his person, family, and property are in jeopardy... and he is at the mercy of his assailant.

    I see it as incumbent on me to provide for the security of myself and my family. That is my responsibility. And no one else can fulfill it. The police certainly cannot. They don't prevent crimes... they don't stop crimes... they come to crime scene after the fact, and write reports about crimes.
    I have posted this in several other threads:

    Quote Originally Posted by Officer "Smith"
    I'm going to say something here that is going to raise some hackles. Then I'm going to explain my statements and, hopefully, make everyone buy it. Here we go. Ready?

    Buy a gun. Get a bat. Own some weapon and have enough skill to use it to save your own life and the lives of your family members. DO NOT RELY ON THE POLICE TO SAVE YOUR LIFE FOR YOU.

    Wait. What's this? What heresy are you speaking of? Officer Smith, are you really telling me not to rely on the police to protect me? What about that "Protect and Serve" horse shit plastered all over the sides of their patrol cars? Aren't they SUPPOSED to protect me?

    Now, let me explain.
    http://officersmith.blogspot.com/201...lp-police.html

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    For those of you who think it is worthwhile to own a gun or a collection of them and possibly other weaponry, what about the fact that you have to register stuff and then they know you have it and can come take it away whenever they want?
    It's a little more complicated than that. Are you at all familiar with Roberti-Roos?
    1w2-6w5-3w2 so/sp

    "I took one those personality tests. It came back negative." - Dan Mintz

  8. #28
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD45T-2 View Post
    It's a little more complicated than that. Are you at all familiar with Roberti-Roos?
    nope

  9. #29
    Sweet Ocean Cloud SD45T-2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    nope
    First this happened: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clevela...ing_(Stockton)

    This was the response: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roberti...ol_Act_of_1989

    This first version of the law banned specific models, such as the HK-91. This left a huge loophole. Some gun makers just changed the names of certain guns they sold in California. The law was then revised to close the loophole by banning guns that fit a certain criteria. In the period between the first and second version of the law, gun sales exploded. So-called assault weapons were flying off the shelves faster than gun dealers could stock them. IIRC, something like 600,000 were sold.

    After the second version of the law went into effect, the legislature decided to require people who had bought guns fitting said criteria during the loophole period to register them. But there was a catch. Because there had been no restrictions at the time, the state had not been keeping track close track of those sales, so the records of those sales were filed away somewhere and largely forgotten, sort of like the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark. The registration requirement was pretty much unenforceable.

    Gun owners knew this, so quite a few of them simply didn't register, and to this day the state still has no idea where most of those guns are or who owns them.
    1w2-6w5-3w2 so/sp

    "I took one those personality tests. It came back negative." - Dan Mintz

  10. #30
    Senior Member statuesquechica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OWK View Post
    .And as for needing to protect yourself against future encroachments by the state.. it remains to be seen how effective firearms ownership will be. There are considerable efforts underway to prohibit firearms ownership by law. I take some measure of comfort in knowing that most of the people who like me, disagree with those efforts.. are already armed.
    The bolded statement above is an outright lie, pure propaganda...the 2nd Amendment has been twisted to mean all sorts of things by the NRA (and its followers) that it makes my head spin. Case in point: failed ex-Governor Sarah Palin supports the NRA.

    What is strange to think is that one point the NRA stood for hunter's safety and believed in common sense gun ownership. I was raised in a hunting family, I went hunting and took the hunter's safety course...I don't fear guns but I do deathly fear the gun-toting maniacs that twist the meaning of the 2nd Amendment at this point in this country.

    Take a gander at what is happening with Cliven Bundy and his militia in NV and their proclamations of the 2nd Amendment...it is frightening how idiotic and dangerous gun owners can be.

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/0...?detail=email#

    To coin a phrase from The Trailer Park Boys (go Canada! and cheeseburgers!) I'm sure my post will open up a shitstorm so I will make myself a rum and coke and watch the shit fall where it may.

    Peace Out
    I've looked at life from both sides now
    From up and down and still somehow
    It's life's illusions I recall
    I really don't know life at all

    Joni Mitchell

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